Hi Dave,

While SpaceX only works with primary single manifest customers, but if those customers can't use the entire payload, then they can work with third party multi-manifest "brokers" and we in turn could work with these multi-manifest "brokers" for a piece of the payload. For sure, lots of negotiating required when and if we find that a primary manifest customer doesn't need the whole payload.

I really don't know if AMSAT management has any activity pursuing this avenue of launch, but if they don't, they should!!

Regards,,,Bill - N6GHz (AMSAT Board Candidate)

Dave hartzell wrote:

David-

Actually, the SpaceX Falcon 1 or 1e could put a spacecraft into HEO or lunar transfer orbit:

http://www.spacex.com/FalconLunarCapabilityGuide.pdf

The stated cost for this is around $9m. Of course, they haven't gotten a successful orbit yet from a F1....maybe the third time will be the charm. Hitching a ride on a larger launch vehicle like the F9 is interesting, assuming there is capacity and the willingness to be a guinea pig (and there WILL be a cost to anyone wanting a ride)...

It will be interesting to see what launch opportunities will be available in the next few years (if any)...

Dave AF6KD

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 4:40 PM, G0MRF@aol.com wrote:

...

The anticipated 'going rate' for this new vehicle is shown at the bottom of the page.

_http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php_ (http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php)

Test flight anyone?

David

---

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Yes, AMSAT has been closely watching the developments with SpaceX for several years. I've also spoken with several people from the company. Currently they do not have a launch vehicle capable of reaching GTO type orbits. That will change as they bring the Falcon-9 on line. I think the encouraging part is they are already accommodating secondary payloads on Falcon-1 missions. What types of capabilities the Falcon-9 will have are as yet unknown.

My day job at the Eastern Range also happens to include working on the Falcon program as SpaceX converts and activates Complex 40 for Falcon-9 launches.

73, Lee-KU4OS AMSAT Exec. VP

On Sunday 20 July 2008 15:45:32 Bill Ress wrote:

Hi Dave,

While SpaceX only works with primary single manifest customers, but if those customers can't use the entire payload, then they can work with third party multi-manifest "brokers" and we in turn could work with these multi-manifest "brokers" for a piece of the payload. For sure, lots of negotiating required when and if we find that a primary manifest customer doesn't need the whole payload.

I really don't know if AMSAT management has any activity pursuing this avenue of launch, but if they don't, they should!!

Regards,,,Bill - N6GHz (AMSAT Board Candidate)

Dave hartzell wrote:

...

David-

Actually, the SpaceX Falcon 1 or 1e could put a spacecraft into HEO or lunar transfer orbit:

http://www.spacex.com/FalconLunarCapabilityGuide.pdf

The stated cost for this is around $9m. Of course, they haven't gotten a successful orbit yet from a F1....maybe the third time will be the charm. Hitching a ride on a larger launch vehicle like the F9 is interesting, assuming there is capacity and the willingness to be a guinea pig (and there WILL be a cost to anyone wanting a ride)...

It will be interesting to see what launch opportunities will be available in the next few years (if any)...

Dave AF6KD

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 4:40 PM, G0MRF@aol.com wrote:

...

The anticipated 'going rate' for this new vehicle is shown at the bottom of the page.

_http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php_ (http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php)

Test flight anyone?

David

---

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Hi,

I have seen a moovie on TV a month ago, about SEA-LAUNCH, an alternative way to launch rockets for commercial Satellites. It was amazing the ship-pad in the middle of Pacific ! I don't know if that is a cheaper launcher or not, however take a look:

http://www.boeing.com/special/sea-launch/

73, Mak SV1BSX

----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Ress" bill@hsmicrowave.com To: "Lee McLamb" ku4os@cfl.rr.com Cc: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 4:13 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Cost of an HEO launch

Hi Lee,

Thanks for your input on SpaceX. Do you know if AMSAT has contacted any of the multi-manifest brokers working with SpaceX to try and flush out cost versus payload estimates on the multi-manifest payloads?

Regards...Bill - N6GHz

Lee McLamb wrote:

...

Yes, AMSAT has been closely watching the developments with SpaceX for several years. I've also spoken with several people from the company. Currently they do not have a launch vehicle capable of reaching GTO type orbits. That will change as they bring the Falcon-9 on line. I think the encouraging part is they are already accommodating secondary payloads on Falcon-1 missions. What types of capabilities the Falcon-9 will have are as yet unknown.

My day job at the Eastern Range also happens to include working on the Falcon program as SpaceX converts and activates Complex 40 for Falcon-9 launches.

73, Lee-KU4OS AMSAT Exec. VP

On Sunday 20 July 2008 15:45:32 Bill Ress wrote:

...

Hi Dave,

While SpaceX only works with primary single manifest customers, but if those customers can't use the entire payload, then they can work with third party multi-manifest "brokers" and we in turn could work with these multi-manifest "brokers" for a piece of the payload. For sure, lots of negotiating required when and if we find that a primary manifest customer doesn't need the whole payload.

I really don't know if AMSAT management has any activity pursuing this avenue of launch, but if they don't, they should!!

Regards,,,Bill - N6GHz (AMSAT Board Candidate)

Dave hartzell wrote:

...

David-

Actually, the SpaceX Falcon 1 or 1e could put a spacecraft into HEO or lunar transfer orbit:

http://www.spacex.com/FalconLunarCapabilityGuide.pdf

The stated cost for this is around $9m. Of course, they haven't gotten a successful orbit yet from a F1....maybe the third time will be the charm. Hitching a ride on a larger launch vehicle like the F9 is interesting, assuming there is capacity and the willingness to be a guinea pig (and there WILL be a cost to anyone wanting a ride)...

It will be interesting to see what launch opportunities will be available in the next few years (if any)...

Dave AF6KD

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 4:40 PM, G0MRF@aol.com wrote:

...

The anticipated 'going rate' for this new vehicle is shown at the bottom of the page.

_http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php_ (http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php)

Test flight anyone?

David

---

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The last time I spoke with them they were pretty focused on getting their Falcon-1 operation going. I will be talking with them again in August.

We're also keeping a keen eye on the Soyuz-ST developments in Kourou. In short I try to look at every launch vehicle and payload adapter and see how it might be useful to AMSAT. I also continue to look at non-GTO options such as GPS-drift orbits and Geosync. That is how the Intelsat rideshare opportunity came to my attention. As a famous scientist said, "We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them". So I try very hard to keep thinking out side the box (or ellipse in the case of orbits) on how achieve our vision.

Lee-KU4OS

On Tuesday 22 July 2008 21:13:36 Bill Ress wrote:

Hi Lee,

Thanks for your input on SpaceX. Do you know if AMSAT has contacted any of the multi-manifest brokers working with SpaceX to try and flush out cost versus payload estimates on the multi-manifest payloads?

Regards...Bill - N6GHz

Lee McLamb wrote:

...

Yes, AMSAT has been closely watching the developments with SpaceX for several years. I've also spoken with several people from the company. Currently they do not have a launch vehicle capable of reaching GTO type orbits. That will change as they bring the Falcon-9 on line. I think the encouraging part is they are already accommodating secondary payloads on Falcon-1 missions. What types of capabilities the Falcon-9 will have are as yet unknown.

My day job at the Eastern Range also happens to include working on the Falcon program as SpaceX converts and activates Complex 40 for Falcon-9 launches.

73, Lee-KU4OS AMSAT Exec. VP

On Sunday 20 July 2008 15:45:32 Bill Ress wrote:

...

Hi Dave,

While SpaceX only works with primary single manifest customers, but if those customers can't use the entire payload, then they can work with third party multi-manifest "brokers" and we in turn could work with these multi-manifest "brokers" for a piece of the payload. For sure, lots of negotiating required when and if we find that a primary manifest customer doesn't need the whole payload.

I really don't know if AMSAT management has any activity pursuing this avenue of launch, but if they don't, they should!!

Regards,,,Bill - N6GHz (AMSAT Board Candidate)

Dave hartzell wrote:

...

David-

Actually, the SpaceX Falcon 1 or 1e could put a spacecraft into HEO or lunar transfer orbit:

http://www.spacex.com/FalconLunarCapabilityGuide.pdf

The stated cost for this is around $9m. Of course, they haven't gotten a successful orbit yet from a F1....maybe the third time will be the charm. Hitching a ride on a larger launch vehicle like the F9 is interesting, assuming there is capacity and the willingness to be a guinea pig (and there WILL be a cost to anyone wanting a ride)...

It will be interesting to see what launch opportunities will be available in the next few years (if any)...

Dave AF6KD

On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 4:40 PM, G0MRF@aol.com wrote:

...

The anticipated 'going rate' for this new vehicle is shown at the bottom of the page.

_http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php_ (http://www.spacex.com/falcon9.php)

Test flight anyone?

David