Re: FM satellite operations again again over Europe
Thank you sharing some good operating practices that would make satellite ops in the US more enjoyable and equitable as well. 73, Gary AB3ID
************************************************************************************* Hi all in Europe, It is obviously about time to repeate a few good points about operating via the FM repeater satellites.
1. Do not transmit if you can not hear it
2. When the satellite is busy - limit the number of QSO's to ONE
3. Do not call over an ongoing QSO
4. A valid QSO just needs the call and the report
5. Give way to weak stations like /p and /m
6. Allow DX-peditions to make as many QSO's as there are callers
That was the short version :-)
I have a long version in English, Italian, Russian, Spanish and French. I can send it to you if you want it. Could use a few other languages like Greek, Polish and others. It would be nice if you can get it in your national journals.
And please no flames !
73 OZ1MY Ib **************************************************************************************
------------------------------
__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Hello all, I found these nice rules from VK3JED:
1. First and foremost is to listen before and while (if possible) transmitting, to ensure your transmissions don't drown out a weaker station who may be on the edge of a pass or running QRP. Satellites should be an alligator free zone. It is strongly recommended that you set your station up so you can monitor the downlink while transmitting, so you can hear how well you are accessing the satellite and whether you accidentally clobbered someone else. Similarly, if you can't hear the transponder, don't transmit. Do something else more productive, such as realign your receiving antenna to improve reception. 2. Be brief. Because the traffic levels can be quite high, contest style (callsign/signal report/next station) operation is the most appropriate for most situations. Many stations also exchange QTH and first names, which is OK if time permits. If transponder activity is low, you can have a brief chat, but the opportunities for this are becoming rare now. 3. Take turns. If you've just worked a handful of stations, be polite and hand the transponder over to someone else so they can work a few. There may be an opportunity to call back in later during the pass and work some different stations as the satellite passes over different areas, and others will appreciate your courtesy. 4. When calling, a simple announcement (e.g. "This is VK3JED listening SUNSAT" or even "VK3JED listening") will suffice, like it does on a terrestrial repeater. Anyone within transponder range will hear your call. A short CQ call ("CQ SUNSAT, this is VK3JED") is OK too. Long CQ calls waste transponder time and frustrate everyone listening. Save the long CQs for HF, where they're appropriate. Only call CQ when there's a distinct lack of activity, such as at the very start of a pass and sometimes late in the pass after everyone else has finished. A well placed CQ call late in a pass might alert someone ahead of the satellite that a pass has just commenced over their QTH. 5. Wait your turn. If a QSO is in progress, wait until it finishes before putting in your call. Butting in too soon is rude and wastes precious transponder time as the stations involved in the QSO have to repeat themselves due to your QRM. 6. Don't tune up! Believe it or not, there are stations who test their satellite access by dropping a carrier over the top of everyone and perhaps announcing "Hello hello". Simply putting out a call at the appropriate time will provide all the signal checks you need (and get you a worthwhile contact! :) ), without annoying everyone else on the transponder. If you're really that doubtful about your equipment, perhaps connect your dummy load, test in the shack and try again another day, rather than disrupting everyone else. If you just want to hear your voice, well a tape recorder or a pair of walkie talkies will do just as well... 7. Reward good operation. If you're answering a call, why not reward the good operators and put the alligators last on your list of priorities. If all satellite users favour good operators, perhaps everyone will learn that good ops have the highest QSO rates and earn the most satellite awards. :-) Peer pressure is a powerful motivating force, as any teenager will know (but probably not admit to! :-) ). 8. Use the minimum power necessary. While power levels are not critical on FM satellites (unlike linear transponders where an excessively strong signal can affect other QSOs on the transponder), using the minimum power necessary allows you to easier tell if you're 'doubling' with someone else. For the South African SUNSAT satellite, you shouldn't need more than 5 watts into a basic (1/2 wave handheld or turnstile) antenna, perhaps a bit more if the antenna is setup for terrestrial operation, to overcome radiation pattern limitations. As an example of good operation, recently one station who had multiple beams wound his power back to 20 mW. The signal into the bird was full quieting, but it was still possible to tell if someone else was underneath his signal. If he had run 100W, he couldn't have known if he'd stepped on anyone else, due to the capture effect of FM.
If everyone follows these simple guidelines (which are basically common sense and courtesy), then FM satellite operation can be enjoyable for everyone, regardless of whether you run a sophisticated satellite station or a couple of handhelds from the back yard. FM satellite transponders are like FM repeaters, only more extreme. On the positive side, they can enable minimally equipped stations thousands of kilometres apart to communicate with ease. On the other hand, the worst aspects of repeaters can be experienced as well, such as congestion, doubling and even the odd idiot dropping carriers! (I don't know how the idiots manage to always have a very strong signal, even when the repeater is 800 km off the ground!). The operators themselves (that's YOU!) have the power to determine what sort of experience FM satellite operation will be in the future.
73, ON4HF.
Eric Knaps Waterstraat 30 B-3980 Tessenderlo Belgium
Tel. +32472985876 (mobile)
Gary Lockhart schreef:
Thank you sharing some good operating practices that would make satellite ops in the US more enjoyable and equitable as well. 73, Gary AB3ID
Hi all in Europe, It is obviously about time to repeate a few good points about operating via the FM repeater satellites.
Do not transmit if you can not hear it
When the satellite is busy - limit the number of QSO's to ONE
Do not call over an ongoing QSO
A valid QSO just needs the call and the report
Give way to weak stations like /p and /m
Allow DX-peditions to make as many QSO's as there are callers
That was the short version :-)
I have a long version in English, Italian, Russian, Spanish and French. I can send it to you if you want it. Could use a few other languages like Greek, Polish and others. It would be nice if you can get it in your national journals.
And please no flames !
73 OZ1MY Ib
Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
on a satellite QSO, is it traditional to say "A, B, C" instead of "Alfa Bravo Charlie" for brevity when referring to call signs and grid locators ?
On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 2:24 PM, Eric Knaps, ON4HF [email protected] wrote:
Hello all, I found these nice rules from VK3JED:
1. First and foremost is to listen before and while (if possible) transmitting, to ensure your transmissions don't drown out a weaker station who may be on the edge of a pass or running QRP. Satellites should be an alligator free zone. It is strongly recommended that you set your station up so you can monitor the downlink while transmitting, so you can hear how well you are accessing the satellite and whether you accidentally clobbered someone else. Similarly, if you can't hear the transponder, don't transmit. Do something else more productive, such as realign your receiving antenna to improve reception. 2. Be brief. Because the traffic levels can be quite high, contest style (callsign/signal report/next station) operation is the most appropriate for most situations. Many stations also exchange QTH and first names, which is OK if time permits. If transponder activity is low, you can have a brief chat, but the opportunities for this are becoming rare now. 3. Take turns. If you've just worked a handful of stations, be polite and hand the transponder over to someone else so they can work a few. There may be an opportunity to call back in later during the pass and work some different stations as the satellite passes over different areas, and others will appreciate your courtesy. 4. When calling, a simple announcement (e.g. "This is VK3JED listening SUNSAT" or even "VK3JED listening") will suffice, like it does on a terrestrial repeater. Anyone within transponder range will hear your call. A short CQ call ("CQ SUNSAT, this is VK3JED") is OK too. Long CQ calls waste transponder time and frustrate everyone listening. Save the long CQs for HF, where they're appropriate. Only call CQ when there's a distinct lack of activity, such as at the very start of a pass and sometimes late in the pass after everyone else has finished. A well placed CQ call late in a pass might alert someone ahead of the satellite that a pass has just commenced over their QTH. 5. Wait your turn. If a QSO is in progress, wait until it finishes before putting in your call. Butting in too soon is rude and wastes precious transponder time as the stations involved in the QSO have to repeat themselves due to your QRM. 6. Don't tune up! Believe it or not, there are stations who test their satellite access by dropping a carrier over the top of everyone and perhaps announcing "Hello hello". Simply putting out a call at the appropriate time will provide all the signal checks you need (and get you a worthwhile contact! :) ), without annoying everyone else on the transponder. If you're really that doubtful about your equipment, perhaps connect your dummy load, test in the shack and try again another day, rather than disrupting everyone else. If you just want to hear your voice, well a tape recorder or a pair of walkie talkies will do just as well... 7. Reward good operation. If you're answering a call, why not reward the good operators and put the alligators last on your list of priorities. If all satellite users favour good operators, perhaps everyone will learn that good ops have the highest QSO rates and earn the most satellite awards. :-) Peer pressure is a powerful motivating force, as any teenager will know (but probably not admit to! :-) ). 8. Use the minimum power necessary. While power levels are not critical on FM satellites (unlike linear transponders where an excessively strong signal can affect other QSOs on the transponder), using the minimum power necessary allows you to easier tell if you're 'doubling' with someone else. For the South African SUNSAT satellite, you shouldn't need more than 5 watts into a basic (1/2 wave handheld or turnstile) antenna, perhaps a bit more if the antenna is setup for terrestrial operation, to overcome radiation pattern limitations. As an example of good operation, recently one station who had multiple beams wound his power back to 20 mW. The signal into the bird was full quieting, but it was still possible to tell if someone else was underneath his signal. If he had run 100W, he couldn't have known if he'd stepped on anyone else, due to the capture effect of FM.
If everyone follows these simple guidelines (which are basically common sense and courtesy), then FM satellite operation can be enjoyable for everyone, regardless of whether you run a sophisticated satellite station or a couple of handhelds from the back yard. FM satellite transponders are like FM repeaters, only more extreme. On the positive side, they can enable minimally equipped stations thousands of kilometres apart to communicate with ease. On the other hand, the worst aspects of repeaters can be experienced as well, such as congestion, doubling and even the odd idiot dropping carriers! (I don't know how the idiots manage to always have a very strong signal, even when the repeater is 800 km off the ground!). The operators themselves (that's YOU!) have the power to determine what sort of experience FM satellite operation will be in the future.
73, ON4HF.
Eric Knaps Waterstraat 30 B-3980 Tessenderlo Belgium
Tel. +32472985876 (mobile)
Gary Lockhart schreef:
Thank you sharing some good operating practices that would make satellite ops in the US more enjoyable and equitable as well. 73, Gary AB3ID
Hi all in Europe, It is obviously about time to repeate a few good points about operating via the FM repeater satellites.
Do not transmit if you can not hear it
When the satellite is busy - limit the number of QSO's to ONE
Do not call over an ongoing QSO
A valid QSO just needs the call and the report
Give way to weak stations like /p and /m
Allow DX-peditions to make as many QSO's as there are callers
That was the short version :-)
I have a long version in English, Italian, Russian, Spanish and French. I can send it to you if you want it. Could use a few other languages like Greek, Polish and others. It would be nice if you can get it in your national journals.
And please no flames !
73 OZ1MY Ib
Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Perhaps these could be translated into Spanish!
David KG4ZLB
Eric Knaps, ON4HF wrote:
Hello all, I found these nice rules from VK3JED:
- First and foremost is to listen before and while (if possible) transmitting, to ensure your transmissions don't drown out a weaker station who may be on the edge of a pass or running QRP. Satellites should be an alligator free zone. It is strongly recommended that you set your station up so you can monitor the downlink while transmitting, so you can hear how well you are accessing the satellite and whether you accidentally clobbered someone else. Similarly, if you can't hear the transponder, don't transmit. Do something else more productive, such as realign your receiving antenna to improve reception.
- Be brief. Because the traffic levels can be quite high, contest style (callsign/signal report/next station) operation is the most appropriate for most situations. Many stations also exchange QTH and first names, which is OK if time permits. If transponder activity is low, you can have a brief chat, but the opportunities for this are becoming rare now.
- Take turns. If you've just worked a handful of stations, be polite and hand the transponder over to someone else so they can work a few. There may be an opportunity to call back in later during the pass and work some different stations as the satellite passes over different areas, and others will appreciate your courtesy.
- When calling, a simple announcement (e.g. "This is VK3JED listening SUNSAT" or even "VK3JED listening") will suffice, like it does on a terrestrial repeater. Anyone within transponder range will hear your call. A short CQ call ("CQ SUNSAT, this is VK3JED") is OK too. Long CQ calls waste transponder time and frustrate everyone listening. Save the long CQs for HF, where they're appropriate. Only call CQ when there's a distinct lack of activity, such as at the very start of a pass and sometimes late in the pass after everyone else has finished. A well placed CQ call late in a pass might alert someone ahead of the satellite that a pass has just commenced over their QTH.
- Wait your turn. If a QSO is in progress, wait until it finishes before putting in your call. Butting in too soon is rude and wastes precious transponder time as the stations involved in the QSO have to repeat themselves due to your QRM.
- Don't tune up! Believe it or not, there are stations who test their satellite access by dropping a carrier over the top of everyone and perhaps announcing "Hello hello". Simply putting out a call at the appropriate time will provide all the signal checks you need (and get you a worthwhile contact! :) ), without annoying everyone else on the transponder. If you're really that doubtful about your equipment, perhaps connect your dummy load, test in the shack and try again another day, rather than disrupting everyone else. If you just want to hear your voice, well a tape recorder or a pair of walkie talkies will do just as well...
- Reward good operation. If you're answering a call, why not reward the good operators and put the alligators last on your list of priorities. If all satellite users favour good operators, perhaps everyone will learn that good ops have the highest QSO rates and earn the most satellite awards. :-) Peer pressure is a powerful motivating force, as any teenager will know (but probably not admit to! :-) ).
- Use the minimum power necessary. While power levels are not critical on FM satellites (unlike linear transponders where an excessively strong signal can affect other QSOs on the transponder), using the minimum power necessary allows you to easier tell if you're 'doubling' with someone else. For the South African SUNSAT satellite, you shouldn't need more than 5 watts into a basic (1/2 wave handheld or turnstile) antenna, perhaps a bit more if the antenna is setup for terrestrial operation, to overcome radiation pattern limitations. As an example of good operation, recently one station who had multiple beams wound his power back to 20 mW. The signal into the bird was full quieting, but it was still possible to tell if someone else was underneath his signal. If he had run 100W, he couldn't have known if he'd stepped on anyone else, due to the capture effect of FM.
If everyone follows these simple guidelines (which are basically common sense and courtesy), then FM satellite operation can be enjoyable for everyone, regardless of whether you run a sophisticated satellite station or a couple of handhelds from the back yard. FM satellite transponders are like FM repeaters, only more extreme. On the positive side, they can enable minimally equipped stations thousands of kilometres apart to communicate with ease. On the other hand, the worst aspects of repeaters can be experienced as well, such as congestion, doubling and even the odd idiot dropping carriers! (I don't know how the idiots manage to always have a very strong signal, even when the repeater is 800 km off the ground!). The operators themselves (that's YOU!) have the power to determine what sort of experience FM satellite operation will be in the future.
73, ON4HF.
Eric Knaps Waterstraat 30 B-3980 Tessenderlo Belgium
Tel. +32472985876 (mobile)
Gary Lockhart schreef:
Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
At 07:53 AM 10/14/2009, David - KG4ZLB wrote:
Perhaps these could be translated into Spanish!
If anyone wants to translate them into any language, go right ahead. Just make a note where the source for the translation came from.
73 de VK3JED / VK3IRL http://vkradio.com
Gary Lockhart wrote:
Thank you sharing some good operating practices that would make satellite ops in the US more enjoyable and equitable as well.
<shameless plug>
Also feel free to check out my "Courteous Ham's Guide to AO-51"
http://www.innismir.net/article/26
</shameless plug>
participants (6)
-
Ben Jackson -
David - KG4ZLB -
Eric Knaps, ON4HF -
Gary Lockhart -
Samudra Haque -
Tony Langdon