Just expanding on my previous thoughts about AMSAT perception....
Expanding on my previous thoughts pasted at bottom...
It seems to me that the 'easy" thing has run it's course. Again, just one mans opinion but I think if you had some sort of setup outside a hamfest with a card table and a folding chair, a sat rig and an Arduino based rotator controller running off a laptop or I-pad and antennas on a "WRAPS" ( I think?) type tripod tracking both Azimuth and Elevation, you'd attract the more technically savvy hams. Probably more youth too. I know in my model railroading hobby that the fact we can now run trains with a smart phone is a big draw. Back in the day, on the not so great passes, I would sometimes fire up the shack computer and my BASIC STAMP based Sabretrack homebrew rotor controller and walk outside and watch my old surplus OR-360 TV rotators moving my homebrew antennas to track the sat across the sky. To me there was a certain "coolness factor" in that which can't be matched by the guy holding the antenna in his hand and waving it about. In fact, my whole idea in buying the beat up telescope tripod was to sit outside at a table with a couple of HT's and my old notebook computer driving the thing with a couple of light weight antennas on board. Yes, I know that I don't necessarily need to track elevation with an LEO but watching the antennas track both is awesome to me. I think we miss the boat sometimes by constantly harping on and touting the "easy" aspect of it. Sometimes complex and high tech is more attractive. Digital modes, SDR and computers have made HF radio hi tech and cool again, at least for me, yet the sat hobby seems to be bending over backwards to over simplify and make things BORRRING! Even model railroads are computer controlled these days! It doesn't have to be super expensive either. An Arduino and some DC motors and gears can be had for less than the cost of a meal for four at Mickey D's. All my OR-360's were was Mabuchi style hobby motors hooked to a gear train. You controlled direction by switching polarity of 12VDC sent up the line and they had position pot feedback. EasyComm format for AZ/EL. But hey, what do I know, I've only been in this hobby forty one years. Just my opinion anyway. That and five bucks will get you a "Venti" designer coffee at Starbucks.
73,
Michael, W4HIJ
Just from the outside looking in...
AMSAT APPEARS only to be interested in hoisting flying repeaters and PACSAT/APRS and showing the average ham how "easy" it is to work sats with a handheld and a simple antenna. I guess that's all well and good but I didn't get in the sat end of the hobby for "easy". I wanted a new challenge. I was too late for A0-40 because of lack of funds for a station but I did have fun for awhile chasing AO-51, FO-29, AO-7 etc. with a TS-2000X and a homebrew rotator and antenna system. Unfortunately, life got in the way and I needed family funds so the Kenwood hit Ebay and I'm inactive on the birds now. I sometimes consider buying a couple of Baofengs (you should ALWAYS operate full duplex but that's another thread) and getting back in on the cheap, I even recently bought a beat up old telescope with a computer tracking tripod system I spotted at Goodwill, but honestly, the challenge isn't there to give me motivation.
Before everyone flames me, as I said, this is from the outside looking in and just one man's opinion. I really wish AMSAT would do something, anything, to change my perception. Seems to me I saw something about a YL running for the board who's interested in open sourcing stuff. Her candidate statement was IMHO, a much needed breath of fresh air but I'm no longer a member and don't keep up so no idea if she got elected. If AMSAT wants my membership and donation dollars back, they need to change perception and I suspect there are many out here in the community who feel the way I do.
Hi Michael,
I don't see anything wrong with "easy". Easy gets people to try new things. I never dreamed I would get into satellites until I read I could hear them with my HT and rubber duck. If not for that I probably wouldn't have followed up and got on FM satellites with a D72 and then linear satellites with a pair of FT-817s.
My circumstances demanded that I operate portable, swinging an Arrow antenna around.
Only now, a few years later, am I at the stage where I'm thinking "yeah, it would be cool to do this and that with an Arduino". Luckily, I'm retired and now have the time to (slowly) learn how to program one.
My point is if people see that some new aspect of amateur radio is actually easy to get into they're more likely to give it a try. Then they'll see the opportunities to use neat tech to make the experience better. That's how I see things happening.
73,
Ken Alexander, VE3HLS So Phisai, Thailand Blog: bueng-ken.com
On Thu, Aug 1, 2019, 08:58 Michael via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
Expanding on my previous thoughts pasted at bottom...
It seems to me that the 'easy" thing has run it's course. Again, just one mans opinion but I think if you had some sort of setup outside a hamfest with a card table and a folding chair, a sat rig and an Arduino based rotator controller running off a laptop or I-pad and antennas on a "WRAPS" ( I think?) type tripod tracking both Azimuth and Elevation, you'd attract the more technically savvy hams. Probably more youth too. I know in my model railroading hobby that the fact we can now run trains with a smart phone is a big draw. Back in the day, on the not so great passes, I would sometimes fire up the shack computer and my BASIC STAMP based Sabretrack homebrew rotor controller and walk outside and watch my old surplus OR-360 TV rotators moving my homebrew antennas to track the sat across the sky. To me there was a certain "coolness factor" in that which can't be matched by the guy holding the antenna in his hand and waving it about. In fact, my whole idea in buying the beat up telescope tripod was to sit outside at a table with a couple of HT's and my old notebook computer driving the thing with a couple of light weight antennas on board. Yes, I know that I don't necessarily need to track elevation with an LEO but watching the antennas track both is awesome to me. I think we miss the boat sometimes by constantly harping on and touting the "easy" aspect of it. Sometimes complex and high tech is more attractive. Digital modes, SDR and computers have made HF radio hi tech and cool again, at least for me, yet the sat hobby seems to be bending over backwards to over simplify and make things BORRRING! Even model railroads are computer controlled these days! It doesn't have to be super expensive either. An Arduino and some DC motors and gears can be had for less than the cost of a meal for four at Mickey D's. All my OR-360's were was Mabuchi style hobby motors hooked to a gear train. You controlled direction by switching polarity of 12VDC sent up the line and they had position pot feedback. EasyComm format for AZ/EL. But hey, what do I know, I've only been in this hobby forty one years. Just my opinion anyway. That and five bucks will get you a "Venti" designer coffee at Starbucks.
73,
Michael, W4HIJ
Just from the outside looking in...
AMSAT APPEARS only to be interested in hoisting flying repeaters and PACSAT/APRS and showing the average ham how "easy" it is to work sats with a handheld and a simple antenna. I guess that's all well and good but I didn't get in the sat end of the hobby for "easy". I wanted a new challenge. I was too late for A0-40 because of lack of funds for a station but I did have fun for awhile chasing AO-51, FO-29, AO-7 etc. with a TS-2000X and a homebrew rotator and antenna system. Unfortunately, life got in the way and I needed family funds so the Kenwood hit Ebay and I'm inactive on the birds now. I sometimes consider buying a couple of Baofengs (you should ALWAYS operate full duplex but that's another thread) and getting back in on the cheap, I even recently bought a beat up old telescope with a computer tracking tripod system I spotted at Goodwill, but honestly, the challenge isn't there to give me motivation.
Before everyone flames me, as I said, this is from the outside looking in and just one man's opinion. I really wish AMSAT would do something, anything, to change my perception. Seems to me I saw something about a YL running for the board who's interested in open sourcing stuff. Her candidate statement was IMHO, a much needed breath of fresh air but I'm no longer a member and don't keep up so no idea if she got elected. If AMSAT wants my membership and donation dollars back, they need to change perception and I suspect there are many out here in the community who feel the way I do.
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I don't mean to suggest there's anything wrong with easy. I just think, as a selling point, it's run it's course is all. How many times are you going to watch a guy at a hamfest with an HT and a handheld antenna exchange grid squares? I would think sooner or later people just walk on by. "Seen it already, where's the new rigs?" It's the same ole, same ole. I see an Arrow antenna sitting on a tripod, seemingly alive, autonomously tracking a sat in Azimuth and Elevation while the operator is busy making contacts, I'm going to stop because that's exciting! My whole point in my post is to try and get AMSAT to do something, anything, different. They need something new to excite the masses. Judging by the response here, it won't happen. That's OK, not everyone is going to see things the same way. I just know what I see and that's an organization that is stuck in the mud and spinning it's wheels, becoming more irrelevant by the day. I doubt my constructive criticism will be received well. It never has been in the past. Another reason I'm no longer a member. They don't seem to listen very well. I wish I had the technical expertise to bring some of my ideas to fruition but I don't. I can follow a circuit diagram and put together projects where someone else has done the engineering but I can't engineer them myself. I often wonder why someone hasn't come up with simple, relatively inexpensive computer driven SDR XCVRS for satellite work. They seem a natural progression from dongles like the Funcube but nothing like that exist that I'm aware of. I'd lap up kits like that.
I believe Michelle is the YL I was speaking of earlier. She certainly seems like a breath of fresh air. AMSAT needs more of her. People who aren't satisfied to rest on past laurels and just maintain the status quo. I'm about to go work some DX with my SDR that is based around an Arduino and it's open source PowerSDR interface that is based on a Raspberry Pi. Now that's exciting!
73,
Michael, W4HIJ
On 8/1/2019 2:14 AM, Kenneth P Alexander wrote:
Hi Michael,
I don't see anything wrong with "easy". Easy gets people to try new things. I never dreamed I would get into satellites until I read I could hear them with my HT and rubber duck. If not for that I probably wouldn't have followed up and got on FM satellites with a D72 and then linear satellites with a pair of FT-817s.
My circumstances demanded that I operate portable, swinging an Arrow antenna around.
Only now, a few years later, am I at the stage where I'm thinking "yeah, it would be cool to do this and that with an Arduino". Luckily, I'm retired and now have the time to (slowly) learn how to program one.
My point is if people see that some new aspect of amateur radio is actually easy to get into they're more likely to give it a try. Then they'll see the opportunities to use neat tech to make the experience better. That's how I see things happening.
73,
Ken Alexander, VE3HLS So Phisai, Thailand Blog: bueng-ken.com http://bueng-ken.com
On Thu, Aug 1, 2019, 08:58 Michael via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@amsat.org mailto:amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
Expanding on my previous thoughts pasted at bottom... It seems to me that the 'easy" thing has run it's course. Again, just one mans opinion but I think if you had some sort of setup outside a hamfest with a card table and a folding chair, a sat rig and an Arduino based rotator controller running off a laptop or I-pad and antennas on a "WRAPS" ( I think?) type tripod tracking both Azimuth and Elevation, you'd attract the more technically savvy hams. Probably more youth too. I know in my model railroading hobby that the fact we can now run trains with a smart phone is a big draw. Back in the day, on the not so great passes, I would sometimes fire up the shack computer and my BASIC STAMP based Sabretrack homebrew rotor controller and walk outside and watch my old surplus OR-360 TV rotators moving my homebrew antennas to track the sat across the sky. To me there was a certain "coolness factor" in that which can't be matched by the guy holding the antenna in his hand and waving it about. In fact, my whole idea in buying the beat up telescope tripod was to sit outside at a table with a couple of HT's and my old notebook computer driving the thing with a couple of light weight antennas on board. Yes, I know that I don't necessarily need to track elevation with an LEO but watching the antennas track both is awesome to me. I think we miss the boat sometimes by constantly harping on and touting the "easy" aspect of it. Sometimes complex and high tech is more attractive. Digital modes, SDR and computers have made HF radio hi tech and cool again, at least for me, yet the sat hobby seems to be bending over backwards to over simplify and make things BORRRING! Even model railroads are computer controlled these days! It doesn't have to be super expensive either. An Arduino and some DC motors and gears can be had for less than the cost of a meal for four at Mickey D's. All my OR-360's were was Mabuchi style hobby motors hooked to a gear train. You controlled direction by switching polarity of 12VDC sent up the line and they had position pot feedback. EasyComm format for AZ/EL. But hey, what do I know, I've only been in this hobby forty one years. Just my opinion anyway. That and five bucks will get you a "Venti" designer coffee at Starbucks. 73, Michael, W4HIJ Just from the outside looking in... AMSAT APPEARS only to be interested in hoisting flying repeaters and PACSAT/APRS and showing the average ham how "easy" it is to work sats with a handheld and a simple antenna. I guess that's all well and good but I didn't get in the sat end of the hobby for "easy". I wanted a new challenge. I was too late for A0-40 because of lack of funds for a station but I did have fun for awhile chasing AO-51, FO-29, AO-7 etc. with a TS-2000X and a homebrew rotator and antenna system. Unfortunately, life got in the way and I needed family funds so the Kenwood hit Ebay and I'm inactive on the birds now. I sometimes consider buying a couple of Baofengs (you should ALWAYS operate full duplex but that's another thread) and getting back in on the cheap, I even recently bought a beat up old telescope with a computer tracking tripod system I spotted at Goodwill, but honestly, the challenge isn't there to give me motivation. Before everyone flames me, as I said, this is from the outside looking in and just one man's opinion. I really wish AMSAT would do something, anything, to change my perception. Seems to me I saw something about a YL running for the board who's interested in open sourcing stuff. Her candidate statement was IMHO, a much needed breath of fresh air but I'm no longer a member and don't keep up so no idea if she got elected. If AMSAT wants my membership and donation dollars back, they need to change perception and I suspect there are many out here in the community who feel the way I do. _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org <mailto:AMSAT-BB@amsat.org>. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
participants (2)
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Kenneth P Alexander -
Michael