D STAR is growing across the US and the world http://www.dstarinfo.com/repeater-maps.aspx
Amsat UK has info about a D STAR satellite http://amsat-uk.org/2013/10/22/integration-of-worlds-first-d-star-cubesat/
If you don't have a radio, you can use a DV Dongle on your computer Give it a try 73 WA4HFN Damon
It would benefit the amateur community more to get support behind NON-PROPRIETARY OPEN PROTOCOLS and SYSTEMS like FreeDV, Speex and Codec2.
Why subject yourself to the "AMBE TAX" ???
de ka2pbt
On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 7:00 PM, wa4hfn@comcast.net wrote:
D STAR is growing across the US and the world http://www.dstarinfo.com/repeater-maps.aspx
Amsat UK has info about a D STAR satellite http://amsat-uk.org/2013/10/22/integration-of-worlds-first-d-star-cubesat/
If you don't have a radio, you can use a DV Dongle on your computer Give it a try 73 WA4HFN Damon
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
D Star satellite?
That sounds like a need idea. Would be nice to do some tests on existing satellites.
With SO-50 it will not work unless someone has figured out how to have D Star (DV) active on any D-Star radio with the required tone enabled. Won't work with the IC-9100. Tried it. Another problem is the 5KHz spacing since you pretty much have to be right on the frequency on the TX and RX. Also, on the IC-9100 it seems to be not possible to set D-Star (DV) on the RX and TX in satellite mode. Anyone else tried it? Also, SatP32 has at the moment no DV functionality for the IC-9100. I guess we have a long way to go :-)
Stefan
On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 1:00 PM, wa4hfn@comcast.net wrote:
D STAR is growing across the US and the world http://www.dstarinfo.com/repeater-maps.aspx
Amsat UK has info about a D STAR satellite http://amsat-uk.org/2013/10/22/integration-of-worlds-first-d-star-cubesat/
If you don't have a radio, you can use a DV Dongle on your computer Give it a try 73 WA4HFN Damon
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Stefan,
It appears that stations attempting to work D-Star via satellite would need to use two radios. This was the case a few years ago, when AA4RC and N3UC were able to make a brief QSO on AO-27. You can read about what gear the used, along with some useful tips for trying D-Star via satellite, at:
The 5 kHz tuning steps for D-Star radios would make satellite operating difficult as you mentioned. AO-27 was the ideal satellite for this sort of experiment, since its uplink receiver was intended for use with data, and doesn't filter the lower end of the audio range that it hears. Plus the control operators of AO-27 have stated clearly that they support and encourage D-Star on AO-27, something not seen for any of our other satellites.
From a quick read of the IC-9100 instruction manual, it
is clear that D-Star was not intended to be used in this radio for satellite operating or for anything other than the "normal" D-Star operations (RX and TX in the same band, simplex or repeater). You could use the IC-9100 as one of the two radios for D-Star satellite operation as those guys did for AO-27 a few years ago, but you would not have access to the IC-9100 satellite functionality.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/
On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 8:18 PM, Stefan Wagener wageners@gmail.com wrote:
D Star satellite?
That sounds like a need idea. Would be nice to do some tests on existing satellites.
With SO-50 it will not work unless someone has figured out how to have D Star (DV) active on any D-Star radio with the required tone enabled. Won't work with the IC-9100. Tried it. Another problem is the 5KHz spacing since you pretty much have to be right on the frequency on the TX and RX. Also, on the IC-9100 it seems to be not possible to set D-Star (DV) on the RX and TX in satellite mode. Anyone else tried it? Also, SatP32 has at the moment no DV functionality for the IC-9100. I guess we have a long way to go :-)
Stefan
Thanks!
Yes, will try to put a few suggestions together for Icom for the next IC-9100 firmware upgrade. It would be a good radio to use next to others.
Have a good weekend,
Stefan
On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 2:45 PM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) < amsat-bb@wd9ewk.net> wrote:
Stefan,
It appears that stations attempting to work D-Star via satellite would need to use two radios. This was the case a few years ago, when AA4RC and N3UC were able to make a brief QSO on AO-27. You can read about what gear the used, along with some useful tips for trying D-Star via satellite, at:
The 5 kHz tuning steps for D-Star radios would make satellite operating difficult as you mentioned. AO-27 was the ideal satellite for this sort of experiment, since its uplink receiver was intended for use with data, and doesn't filter the lower end of the audio range that it hears. Plus the control operators of AO-27 have stated clearly that they support and encourage D-Star on AO-27, something not seen for any of our other satellites.
From a quick read of the IC-9100 instruction manual, it is clear that D-Star was not intended to be used in this radio for satellite operating or for anything other than the "normal" D-Star operations (RX and TX in the same band, simplex or repeater). You could use the IC-9100 as one of the two radios for D-Star satellite operation as those guys did for AO-27 a few years ago, but you would not have access to the IC-9100 satellite functionality.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/
On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 8:18 PM, Stefan Wagener wageners@gmail.com wrote:
D Star satellite?
That sounds like a need idea. Would be nice to do some tests on existing satellites.
With SO-50 it will not work unless someone has figured out how to have D Star (DV) active on any D-Star radio with the required tone enabled.
Won't
work with the IC-9100. Tried it. Another problem is the 5KHz spacing
since
you pretty much have to be right on the frequency on the TX and RX. Also, on the IC-9100 it seems to be not possible to set D-Star (DV) on the RX
and
TX in satellite mode. Anyone else tried it? Also, SatP32 has at the
moment
no DV functionality for the IC-9100. I guess we have a long way to go :-)
Stefan
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On 11/11/13 7:45 AM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) wrote:
Stefan,
It appears that stations attempting to work D-Star via satellite would need to use two radios. This was the case a few years ago, when AA4RC and N3UC were able to make a brief QSO on AO-27. You can read about what gear the used, along with some useful tips for trying D-Star via satellite, at:
If the new satellite has AFC and a 2m uplink, existing D-STAR radios should be suitable for the uplink. That leaves the downlink, where I'd probably use something like an all mode radio with computer controlled Doppler correction and a GMSK modem with DV Dongle or DV-RPTR board with an on board AMBE decoder.
Where things could get really interesting is D-STAR allows easy interfacing to the Internet, so theoretically, you could enable (for a few minutes!) global connectivity to remote areas.
On 11 Nov 2013 at 10:51, Tony Langdon wrote:
On 11/11/13 7:45 AM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) wrote:
Stefan,
It appears that stations attempting to work D-Star via satellite would need to use two radios. This was the case a few years ago, when AA4RC and N3UC were able to make a brief QSO on AO-27. You can read about what gear the used, along with some useful tips for trying D-Star via satellite, at:
If the new satellite has AFC and a 2m uplink, existing D-STAR radios should be suitable for the uplink. That leaves the downlink, where I'd probably use something like an all mode radio with computer controlled Doppler correction and a GMSK modem with DV Dongle or DV-RPTR board with an on board AMBE decoder.
Where things could get really interesting is D-STAR allows easy interfacing to the Internet, so theoretically, you could enable (for a few minutes!) global connectivity to remote areas.
-- 73 de Tony VK3JED/VK3IRL http://vkradio.com
You can read and hear about my first AO-27 DSTAR test transmission made on September 5 2009. Unfortunately numerous attemps to have another station to complete a QSO remain unsuccesfull. Some stations where not able to get to the satellite.
You can hear the audio recording on Matthias dd1us web site http://www.dd1us.de/spacesounds%202c.html scoll down to:
Amrad OSCAR 27 (EYESAT-1) #22825 (1993-061C)
"Usually analog FM voice transmissions are used via AO-27. However the new DSTAR standard which is intended to be used via terrestrial FM repeaters can be also used via satellite as the test transmission of Luc Leblanc VE2DWE demonstrates. He used an ICOM IC2200 TRX for the 436.795 MHz downlink and a ICOM ID-800H for the 145.850 MHz uplink. Recorded on September 5th 2009 at 22:49 UTC and kindly provided by VE2DWE."
You can also hear the recording on my web page at: www.qsl.net/ve2dwe (Firefox will not let you hear it IE will...)
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Actually, after more than 10 years on the market, D-STAR has only about 28,000 registered users worldwide. There are fewer than 2000 active users, worldwide, daily. Many people are wondering why Icom keeps pouring money into something which is clearly unsustainable in the long run.
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it.
George, KA3HSW
----- Original Message ----- From: wa4hfn@comcast.net To: "AMSAT" amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 1:00 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] D STAR
D STAR is growing across the US and the world http://www.dstarinfo.com/repeater-maps.aspx
Amsat UK has info about a D STAR satellite http://amsat-uk.org/2013/10/22/integration-of-worlds-first-d-star-cubesat/
If you don't have a radio, you can use a DV Dongle on your computer Give it a try 73 WA4HFN Damon
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
On 11 Nov 2013 at 0:14, George Henry wrote:
Actually, after more than 10 years on the market, D-STAR has only about 28,000 registered users worldwide. There are fewer than 2000 active users, worldwide, daily. Many people are wondering why Icom keeps pouring money into something which is clearly unsustainable in the long run.
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it.
George, KA3HSW
Hi Georges
I don't remember how long it takes to see AM disappear replaced by SSB but last week an old ham just telling me how easy it was to tune a station in AM he just get back on the air with a 21st century radio after a 20 years leave. He's right but the earth still continue to rotate.
10 years is quite a long run as per our today standards where your PC is no more up to date after 2 years.
Length of a run appears shorter but not automatically harder when you get old. Einstein call that "relativity" ;)
I already know 2 hams here up north who just get the new IC-7100 HF/VHF/UHF Transceiver. Between you and me they surely make some sort of market survey before as you said "pouring money into something which is clearly unsustainable in the long run."
My short two cents.
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Life is a sexually transmitted deadly disease.
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 12:14:26AM -0600, George Henry wrote:
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it. George, KA3HSW
What, apart from encryption being illegal on the amateur bands?
Without a radical redesign and a new codec, DStar is just not suitable for amateur use. Proprietary software runs counter to the whole principle of amateur radio, and in this case the encrypted proprietary codec is quite possibly not legal for amateur use.
The unique feature of D-STAR for amateur use is that if a user doesn't like the price, or doesn't like the fact that ICOM is using an AMBE chip, or doesn't like ICOM because they capitalize every letter in their name, or because they think that the gubment is going to break down their door because they are encrypting their signal, or because they don't like anything new, with D-STAR the user simply doesn't have to use it.
But, if a amateur doesn't like it there is an absolute, gubment-mandated requirement that he or she tell everyone that cares or doesn't as to why he or she doesn't like it and/or why they never will.
Steve, W5IEM On Nov 11, 2013 3:44 AM, "Gordon JC Pearce" gordonjcp@gjcp.net wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 12:14:26AM -0600, George Henry wrote:
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it. George, KA3HSW
What, apart from encryption being illegal on the amateur bands?
Without a radical redesign and a new codec, DStar is just not suitable for amateur use. Proprietary software runs counter to the whole principle of amateur radio, and in this case the encrypted proprietary codec is quite possibly not legal for amateur use.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
It would benefit the amateur community more to get support behind NON-PROPRIETARY OPEN PROTOCOLS and SYSTEMS like FreeDV, Speex and Codec2.
Why subject yourself to the "AMBE TAX" ???
de ka2pbt
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Steve May steve.w5iem@gmail.com wrote:
The unique feature of D-STAR for amateur use is that if a user doesn't like the price, or doesn't like the fact that ICOM is using an AMBE chip, or doesn't like ICOM because they capitalize every letter in their name, or because they think that the gubment is going to break down their door because they are encrypting their signal, or because they don't like anything new, with D-STAR the user simply doesn't have to use it.
But, if a amateur doesn't like it there is an absolute, gubment-mandated requirement that he or she tell everyone that cares or doesn't as to why he or she doesn't like it and/or why they never will.
Steve, W5IEM On Nov 11, 2013 3:44 AM, "Gordon JC Pearce" gordonjcp@gjcp.net wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 12:14:26AM -0600, George Henry wrote:
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it. George, KA3HSW
What, apart from encryption being illegal on the amateur bands?
Without a radical redesign and a new codec, DStar is just not suitable
for
amateur use. Proprietary software runs counter to the whole principle of amateur radio, and in this case the encrypted proprietary codec is quite possibly not legal for amateur use.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 11:34:58AM +0000, Rob wrote:
It would benefit the amateur community more to get support behind NON-PROPRIETARY OPEN PROTOCOLS and SYSTEMS like FreeDV, Speex and Codec2.
Why subject yourself to the "AMBE TAX" ???
Furthermore, if I want to use digital voice to talk to someone on the other side of the world, instead of buying an expensive DStar rig and hoping that the cobbled-together infrastructure holds up I'll just whip out my phone and enjoy the greater clarity and reliability of GSM.
I just don't see why having a locked-down proprietary system like DStar is good. You might as well just use Skype, or mobile phones, or CB.
An interesting idea would be trying a FreeDV QSO via satellite. I've made a few QSOs with it on HF and it's an interesting mode.
Obviously it's full duty-cycle, so any attempts should be limited to just a few tests, but I'm sure it would work.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 6:52 AM, Gordon JC Pearce gordonjcp@gjcp.netwrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 11:34:58AM +0000, Rob wrote:
It would benefit the amateur community more to get support behind NON-PROPRIETARY OPEN PROTOCOLS and SYSTEMS like FreeDV, Speex and Codec2.
Why subject yourself to the "AMBE TAX" ???
Furthermore, if I want to use digital voice to talk to someone on the other side of the world, instead of buying an expensive DStar rig and hoping that the cobbled-together infrastructure holds up I'll just whip out my phone and enjoy the greater clarity and reliability of GSM.
I just don't see why having a locked-down proprietary system like DStar is good. You might as well just use Skype, or mobile phones, or CB.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
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FreeDV would probably work on the transponder birds if your doppler update was fast enough... it has built-in AFC. Your only chance to try it on an FM bird would probably be in the middle of the night...
George, KA3HSW
----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Stoetzer" n8hm@arrl.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 7:17 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
An interesting idea would be trying a FreeDV QSO via satellite. I've made a few QSOs with it on HF and it's an interesting mode.
Obviously it's full duty-cycle, so any attempts should be limited to just a few tests, but I'm sure it would work.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On 12/11/13 4:10 PM, George Henry wrote:
FreeDV would probably work on the transponder birds if your doppler update was fast enough... it has built-in AFC. Your only chance to try it on an FM bird would probably be in the middle of the night...
I'd be looking at using FreeDV with the linear birds in its current form, and definitely with Doppler correction. The PAPR is fairly high, so the overall transponder power drain would be no more than for a SSB transmission of similar length. Uplink power control might need to be a bit more accurate, because the satellite's AGC may not be able to track the brief power peaks. Likely to be a case where "less is more" when it comes to uplink power.
On 12/11/13 12:17 AM, Paul Stoetzer wrote:
An interesting idea would be trying a FreeDV QSO via satellite. I've made a few QSOs with it on HF and it's an interesting mode.
Obviously it's full duty-cycle, so any attempts should be limited to just a few tests, but I'm sure it would work.
I suspect you'd need computer Doppler correction with the FDMDV modem. The high PAPR would limit the stress on a linear transponder. The (yet to be finalised) VHF GMSK variant might be easier to handle from a Doppler point of view, though at a higher average power (since it's constant envelope like FM).
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 05:09:56PM +1100, Tony Langdon wrote:
On 12/11/13 12:17 AM, Paul Stoetzer wrote:
An interesting idea would be trying a FreeDV QSO via satellite. I've made a few QSOs with it on HF and it's an interesting mode.
Obviously it's full duty-cycle, so any attempts should be limited to just a few tests, but I'm sure it would work.
I suspect you'd need computer Doppler correction with the FDMDV modem. The high PAPR would limit the stress on a linear transponder. The (yet to be finalised) VHF GMSK variant might be easier to handle from a Doppler point of view, though at a higher average power (since it's constant envelope like FM).
You could simulate doppler by injecting a suitable voltage ramp into your RIT control, making your HF rig "drift" in a known way.
On 11 Nov 2013, at 11:52, Gordon JC Pearce gordonjcp@gjcp.net wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 11:34:58AM +0000, Rob wrote:
It would benefit the amateur community more to get support behind NON-PROPRIETARY OPEN PROTOCOLS and SYSTEMS like FreeDV, Speex and Codec2.
Why subject yourself to the "AMBE TAX" ???
Furthermore, if I want to use digital voice to talk to someone on the other side of the world, instead of buying an expensive DStar rig and hoping that the cobbled-together infrastructure holds up I'll just whip out my phone and enjoy the greater clarity and reliability of GSM.
I just don't see why having a locked-down proprietary system like DStar is good. You might as well just use Skype, or mobile phones, or CB.
As far as I know, none of those work on AO-27
Dominic G6NQO.
On 11/11/13 6:44 PM, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 12:14:26AM -0600, George Henry wrote:
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it. George, KA3HSW
What, apart from encryption being illegal on the amateur bands?
Without a radical redesign and a new codec, DStar is just not suitable for amateur use. Proprietary software runs counter to the whole principle of amateur radio, and in this case the encrypted proprietary codec is quite possibly not legal for amateur use.
That argument is a furphy. AMBE is readily available in a $20 chip if the authorities want to listen in, it's not encrytion (formally defined as encoding to obscure the meaning of a transmission), it's encoding to minimise the audio data transmitted for intelligible speech.
D-STAR itself is open specification, and a significant proportion (a majority now?) of D-STAR gateways run open source software (such as the G4KLX pcrepeatercontroller/ircddbgateway software) on both Icom repeater hardware and homebrew setups.
Sure, an open source vocoder would have been nice, but one with suitable performance and available in a form that could be incorporated into radios didn't exist when D-STAR was developed. Had D-STAR been developed today, Codec2 would be a real option (though I'm not yet aware of an implementation suitable for a mobile or HT).
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
On 11/11/13, George Henry ka3hsw@att.net wrote:
Actually, after more than 10 years on the market, D-STAR has only about 28,000 registered users worldwide. There are fewer than 2000 active users,
worldwide, daily. Many people are wondering why Icom keeps pouring money into something which is clearly unsustainable in the long run.
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it.
George, KA3HSW
----- Original Message ----- From: wa4hfn@comcast.net To: "AMSAT" amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 1:00 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] D STAR
D STAR is growing across the US and the world http://www.dstarinfo.com/repeater-maps.aspx
Amsat UK has info about a D STAR satellite http://amsat-uk.org/2013/10/22/integration-of-worlds-first-d-star-cubesat/
If you don't have a radio, you can use a DV Dongle on your computer Give it a try 73 WA4HFN Damon
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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d star may be all ok on paths where it is a perfect signal, but nywhere that there is QSB or QRM or QRN it is dead in the water and is useless. And 90% of Amateur radio has those issues to deal with.
Joe WB9SBD Sig The Original Rolling Ball Clock Idle Tyme Idle-Tyme.com http://www.idle-tyme.com On 11/11/2013 8:46 AM, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
On 11/11/13, George Henry ka3hsw@att.net wrote:
Actually, after more than 10 years on the market, D-STAR has only about 28,000 registered users worldwide. There are fewer than 2000 active users,
worldwide, daily. Many people are wondering why Icom keeps pouring money into something which is clearly unsustainable in the long run.
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it.
George, KA3HSW
----- Original Message ----- From: wa4hfn@comcast.net To: "AMSAT" amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 1:00 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] D STAR
D STAR is growing across the US and the world http://www.dstarinfo.com/repeater-maps.aspx
Amsat UK has info about a D STAR satellite http://amsat-uk.org/2013/10/22/integration-of-worlds-first-d-star-cubesat/
If you don't have a radio, you can use a DV Dongle on your computer Give it a try 73 WA4HFN Damon
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On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
When GO32 was running, we were able to send and receive data at 9600 bps. DSTAR voice. on 444 is 2400bps and data is 4800bps gsm if I am correct.
So, why would it not work via satellite other than having to get 5 kc steps reduced to 1k or less.
73 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon JC Pearce" gordonjcp@gjcp.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 9:22 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
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Great point!
Hi Angelo,
Jeff - K2AK (X-K7WIN)
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Angelo Glorioso Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 8:57 AM To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
When GO32 was running, we were able to send and receive data at 9600 bps. DSTAR voice. on 444 is 2400bps and data is 4800bps gsm if I am correct.
So, why would it not work via satellite other than having to get 5 kc steps reduced to 1k or less.
73 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon JC Pearce" gordonjcp@gjcp.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 9:22 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Yes,
It could work as long as software for doppler control (eg SatPc32) can invoke the smaller frequency changes which it actually can (see my other note on the IC-9100). So you would use the built-in DSTAR module for uplink or downlink and the 9600 packet mode with a GMSK node adapter for the other in a full duple radio like the IC-9100. Or you use two radios in 9600 packet mode with 2 node adapters for uplink and downlink as long as they are supported via doppler software and small frequency steps.
Stefan
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 10:05 AM, K2AK - Jeff k2ak@k2ak.net wrote:
Great point!
Hi Angelo,
Jeff - K2AK (X-K7WIN)
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Angelo Glorioso Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 8:57 AM To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
When GO32 was running, we were able to send and receive data at 9600 bps. DSTAR voice. on 444 is 2400bps and data is 4800bps gsm if I am correct.
So, why would it not work via satellite other than having to get 5 kc steps reduced to 1k or less.
73 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon JC Pearce" gordonjcp@gjcp.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 9:22 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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On 12/11/13 3:25 AM, Stefan Wagener wrote:
Yes,
It could work as long as software for doppler control (eg SatPc32) can invoke the smaller frequency changes which it actually can (see my other note on the IC-9100). So you would use the built-in DSTAR module for uplink or downlink and the 9600 packet mode with a GMSK node adapter for the other in a full duple radio like the IC-9100. Or you use two radios in 9600 packet mode with 2 node adapters for uplink and downlink as long as they are supported via doppler software and small frequency steps.
I think setups using GMSK modems or a DV-RPTR board and an all mode radio with Doppler correction will have the most success on satellite D-STAR, because computer Doppler compensation and the small tuning step size will keep everything within tolerance. Time to pull my DV-RPTR board out and hook it up to the IC-7000. :)
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters---for-more-information--... you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
"To help the non beleiver.. "
Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way repeaters are ... but I digress)
I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the radio art ... it does not promote innovation ...
Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever you need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've learned nothing and you've given nothing back.
The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any value for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the highest bidder.
We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, lucleblanc6@videotron.ca wrote:
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one
manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE
codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters---for-more-information--... you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
"To help the believer " :-)
Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it in a long time.
Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the radio art!!!!!!
7 3 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
"To help the non beleiver.. "
Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way repeaters are ... but I digress)
I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the radio art ... it does not promote innovation ...
Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever you need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've learned nothing and you've given nothing back.
The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any value for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the highest bidder.
We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, lucleblanc6@videotron.ca wrote:
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only one
manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE
codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters---for-more-information--... you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso n5uxt@hotmail.com wrote:
"To help the believer " :-)
Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it in a long time.
Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the radio art!!!!!!
7 3 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
"To help the non beleiver.. "
Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way repeaters are ... but I digress)
I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the radio art ... it does not promote innovation ...
Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever you need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've learned nothing and you've given nothing back.
The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any value for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the highest bidder.
We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, lucleblanc6@videotron.ca wrote:
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only >
one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE
codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the >
author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters- --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1& ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+ you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sorry. I thought we were comparing apples with apples.
PS: By the way, apple (big brother is watching you ) :-)
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 11:26 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso n5uxt@hotmail.com wrote:
"To help the believer " :-)
Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it in a long time.
Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the radio art!!!!!!
7 3 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
"To help the non beleiver.. "
Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way repeaters are ... but I digress)
I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the radio art ... it does not promote innovation ...
Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever you need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've learned nothing and you've given nothing back.
The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any value for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the highest bidder.
We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, lucleblanc6@videotron.ca wrote:
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only
one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE
codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the >
author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters- --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1& ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+ you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
An example of an enhancement to the radio art would be PSK31 for example.
Created by an amateur radio operator used by amateur radio operators. An amazing technology for weak signal work. Multiple conversations tacking place in a single SSB "channel."
Don't misinterpret what I'm saying ... D-STAR is neat .... but if I (or someone smarter than me) can't fabricate it from core technologies it can't be fully understood or improved upon. Which is what this hobby is suppose to be about.
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:48 PM, Angelo Glorioso n5uxt@hotmail.com wrote:
Sorry. I thought we were comparing apples with apples.
PS: By the way, apple (big brother is watching you ) :-)
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 11:26 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso n5uxt@hotmail.com wrote:
"To help the believer " :-)
Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it in a long time.
Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the radio art!!!!!!
7 3 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
"To help the non beleiver.. "
Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way repeaters are ... but I digress)
I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the radio art ... it does not promote innovation ...
Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever you need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've learned nothing and you've given nothing back.
The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any value for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the highest bidder.
We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, lucleblanc6@videotron.ca wrote:
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote: > Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same > thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR > it > is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, > there is something for everyone > 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only >
one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE
codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the >
author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters- --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1& ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+ you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
And we all know how open source that iPhone is.
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Rob Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 12:26 PM To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso n5uxt@hotmail.com wrote:
"To help the believer " :-)
Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it in a long time.
Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the radio art!!!!!!
7 3 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
"To help the non beleiver.. "
Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way repeaters are ... but I digress)
I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the radio art ... it does not promote innovation ...
Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever you need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've learned nothing and you've given nothing back.
The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any value for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the highest bidder.
We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, lucleblanc6@videotron.ca wrote:
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only >
one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE
codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
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author.
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To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters- --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1& ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+ you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
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If the iPhone is discontinued, one can just pickup another phone. There's no single owner of the LTE protocol or the various 3G protocols.
I don't think the AMBE patent material is complete enough to write an implementation, otherwise someone would have created an open source version of it by now.
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:31 PM, Craig Gagner crgagner@charter.net wrote:
And we all know how open source that iPhone is.
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Rob Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 12:26 PM To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
I can do all that with my iphone .... which are the enhancements?
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 5:18 PM, Angelo Glorioso n5uxt@hotmail.com wrote:
"To help the believer " :-)
Either you have not used Dstar before or have not used it in a long time.
Have your tried to send a picture with Dstar??
Have you chatted voice and text as the same time??
Have you tried to surf the web with DStar.
Have you used DRats for Emergencies, trainings or other exercises ???
Just to mention a few things that add to the enhancement of the radio art!!!!!!
7 3 de Angelo
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob" pabutusa@gmail.com To: AMSAT-BB@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:39 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: D STAR
"To help the non beleiver.. "
Well I guess it official ... it's now become a religious argument.
D-STAR is the "fast-food" of amateur radio (much the same way repeaters are ... but I digress)
I'm not arguing the technical merits .... but it does not enhance the radio art ... it does not promote innovation ...
Sure you can buy a radio ... plug it in .... program it or what ever you need to do to get on "the net" and talk to someone .... you've learned nothing and you've given nothing back.
The spectrum we use is very valuable .... if we're not generating any value for what we've been entrusted with it's going to be sold off to the highest bidder.
We need more of this -> http://wc2fd.com/eaps/
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 4:32 PM, lucleblanc6@videotron.ca wrote:
On 11 Nov 2013 at 15:22, Gordon JC Pearce wrote:
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 08:46:24AM -0600, damon runion wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
But the difference there is that *anyone* can make an SSB rig. Only >
one manufacturer is allowed to make AMBE codecs, and they will only sell to a handful of approved radio manufacturers.
It is illegal to make your own DStar radio, without buying the AMBE
codec from DVSI. That sort of thing has no place in amateur radio.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the >
author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
To help the non beleiver.. just read this:
http://www.eham.net/articles/30174
And yes telephone and satellite phone are available but if one choose to use DSTAR it is relevant to discredit him? If you think something has no place im amateur radio just don't use it and let those who wants to use it enjoy one of the most reliable digital communication protocol available. Yes some will say DMR, MotoTRBO are better it's just to say competition is already present.
The cost question. You can already interface a lot of recent HF transceiver to DSTAR for 700$ and much less if you are technicaly inclined.See below it's just an example and i'm not connected to their business.
http://dstarradioclub-international.com/dv-adapters- --for-more-information--manual-links.html?success=1& ucfid=510239683496259871&text=Thank+ you.+Your+information+has+been+submitted
I don't know where this "I don't use it and as i think it's not Ham radio no one should use it" trend come from but it's getting old...
I'm an avid DSTAR user just put my call sing in your URCALL and you will be able to reach me all over the globe. If you don't like the internet component you better to go back to the cave man, or you don't live on my planet.
Just let folks live free...
Luc Leblanc VE2DWE WAC BASIC CW PHONE SATELLITE
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the
author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the
author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 06:45:02PM -0500, Goody K3NG wrote:
I don't think the AMBE patent material is complete enough to write an implementation, otherwise someone would have created an open source version of it by now.
There is mbelib, but because AMBE and friends are patented it is not legal to write or use anything other than DVSI's chip.
I have no doubt some form of voice over data will be the norm someday but I have doubts that will be D-STAR in it's current form. If it switches to a non-proprietary protocol ... or the patent on AMBE expires then maybe.
... but Amateur Radio isn't about just buying some vendors latest gadget like it's the latest iPhone .... it's about experimentation or more accurately:
Continuation and extension of the amateur's proven ability to contribute
to the advancement of the radio art.
Encouragement and improvement of the amateur service through rules which
provide for advancing skills in both the communication and technical phases of the art.
Expansion of the existing reservoir within the amateur radio service of
trained operators, technicians, and electronics experts.
(source: Title 47 CFR Part 97.1)
On Mon, Nov 11, 2013 at 2:46 PM, damon runion damonwa4hfn@gmail.com wrote:
Well back in the days of AM and when SSB came out it was the same thinking then BUT what has happened to AM . Same thing with DSTAR it is growing and will grow . Thats what makes ham radio so much fun, there is something for everyone 73,s Damon
On 11/11/13, George Henry ka3hsw@att.net wrote:
Actually, after more than 10 years on the market, D-STAR has only about 28,000 registered users worldwide. There are fewer than 2000 active
users,
worldwide, daily. Many people are wondering why Icom keeps pouring money into something which is clearly unsustainable in the long run.
There are very good reasons why no other amateur radio manufacturer will touch it.
George, KA3HSW
----- Original Message ----- From: wa4hfn@comcast.net To: "AMSAT" amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 1:00 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] D STAR
D STAR is growing across the US and the world http://www.dstarinfo.com/repeater-maps.aspx
Amsat UK has info about a D STAR satellite
http://amsat-uk.org/2013/10/22/integration-of-worlds-first-d-star-cubesat/
If you don't have a radio, you can use a DV Dongle on your computer Give it a try 73 WA4HFN Damon
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author.
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Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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I use D-STAR Digital Data on 1.2 GHz for my Winlink RMS Packet CMS connection, 24/7. The Pactor 3 mode that I use for Winlink HF forwarding is proprietary. But nobody else has come up with anything near as good (yet). So a lot of hams use it because it does the job well. We use D-STAR DD 1.2 GHz as a backup to the local internet connection for EMCOMM at the EOC and I do the same at home, too. WebEOC for example. D-STAR is another tool in the box, another readily available method that might be better in a particular circumstance. Why limit myself by not having a set of metric sockets for my wrench?
But to the subject how about some D-STAR DD on the satellites? You would need to figure out a way around the L-band downlink e.g. a receive converter from another band or something... Maybe not necessarily (easily) feasible but nonetheless perhaps a thought path to other digital ideas for satellites. Both data and voice. These are just more fun things to think about!
By the way, did you know that the MCU on the Fox-1 satellite is proprietary? ;-)
Jerry N0JY
On 11/11/2013 9:22 AM, Rob wrote:
I have no doubt some form of voice over data will be the norm someday but I have doubts that will be D-STAR in it's current form. If it switches to a non-proprietary protocol ... or the patent on AMBE expires then maybe.
... but Amateur Radio isn't about just buying some vendors latest gadget like it's the latest iPhone .... it's about experimentation or more accurately:
Continuation and extension of the amateur's proven ability to contribute
to the advancement of the radio art.
Encouragement and improvement of the amateur service through rules which
provide for advancing skills in both the communication and technical phases of the art.
Expansion of the existing reservoir within the amateur radio service of
trained operators, technicians, and electronics experts.
(source: Title 47 CFR Part 97.1)
participants (19)
-
Angelo Glorioso -
Craig Gagner -
damon runion -
Dominic Hawken -
George Henry -
Goody K3NG -
Gordon JC Pearce -
Joe -
K2AK - Jeff -
lucleblanc6＠videotron.ca -
n0jy -
Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) -
Paul Stoetzer -
Rob -
Rob Roschewsk -
Stefan Wagener -
Steve May -
Tony Langdon -
wa4hfn＠comcast.net