Hi
After reading various posts I decided that having time one my hands at the moment, I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever capacity I can. I think being able to help build a satellite is probably out of my league. But I could help out collating information and updating websites etc. I run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Hopefully someone can contact me for a discussion on how I can help.
Steve
G6UIM
Email steve@daniels270.eclipse.co.uk
I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever capacity I can. I run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Seeing your message, caused me to stop and think, what is the next thing I think might be valuable to help the general amateur radio operators to better operate the satellites? Again, this might not be at all what you are interested in, but let me have a go at defining a nice project for someone in case this fits anyone's talents.
PROBLEM: To play satellites, you need to have a tracking program and to WATCH it all the time or do PLANNING to know when to go play satellites. Actually, this is so... Past decade.
OBJECTIVE: What we need is a "service" that continuously feeds SAT-IN-VIEW information to everyone in the field right there on their radio front panel, whenever any AMSAT is in view. This way, you can be mobile, or hiking, or anywhere on the planet, and right their even without ASKING, the information will be PUSHED to you.
SOLUTION: Actually, this capability has existed since about 1997 on the APRS channel, but it only works where a LOCAL individual runs either APRSdata or DIGI_NED in the local region, and maintains it. In this case, mobiles, or anyone monitoring the national APRS channel will receive this INSTANT information not only showing any SAT in view, but also its AZIMUTH, ELEVATION and FREQUENCY of both the uplink and downlink AND DOPPLER!
You can see examples of this system on http://www.aprs.org/localinfo.html . Move your slider about 90% down the page and look for the paragraph LOCAL SATELLITE ALERTS.
This way you don't need any PC, or anything. But if you are mobile and if a satellite comes above the horizon in your area, and you monitor APRS on your APRS mobile radio, then you will be able to work the satellite (also mobile, since we only output the satellites that are easy to work from a mobile)... The info on the satellite is updated once each minute when it is above the horizon.
Also, once each TEN minutes a SCHEDULE of any satellites coming up in the next 80 minutes is transmitted to the DX LIST inside your radio, so you can also check for any future passes.
PROJECT: Rather than having to have 1000 volunteers all over the world, one in the footprint of every APRS local area have to operate and maintain one of these programs (which is why most people never see these alerts), it would be nice if there was just ONE central server that fed this data everywhere. Then only one person would have to update the server when new satellites were launched and once every week or so to download new TLE element sets.
ISSUES: In one sense this would be a great step forward, in centralizing the generation of this data. But the problem is, that it still will not go from the APRS-internet stream back to local RF in each local area, unless a local Igate operator adds the "server" to his gate-to-RF list. But at least that is much simpler than having to maintain a program. Local AMSAT mobiles who want this feed, just ask their local Igate operator to add the server, and from then on, whenever mobile, they will see these alerts.
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a satellite, even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a satellite in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its Doppler, right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
See the web page for what these displays look like on an APRS radio:
Bob, WB4APR
Actually, There is another similar WEB page project That does the same thing for ALL mobile operators, Not just those with APRS displays. It is simpler And only has a single TEXT output:
Please see the idea on this web page: http://www.aprs.org/MobileLEOtracking.html
PROJECT OBJECTIVE: Develop a web page that any amateur radio operator can go to that will print out this very simple PAPER tracking device. It is just a piece of paper with 5 columns for each of 5 days, and on each of those five days, the TIME of the best overhead pass for that users local area (morning and evening). For ECHO (AO51) this simple piece of paper with 10 times on it can be used for SHOWING the pass times of ALL morning and evening passes for the next 2 or 3 months!
You don't need no stinkin computer to always know when AO51 is overhead while you are mobile! Just look at the TIME on the paper for today's date. (ECHO's pass times repeat every 5 days)... Each other satellite has similar REPEATABILITY. Just pring one of these slips of papwer for your favorite satellite, and you will never need to do a prediciton again, yet, will always hve what you need in the car to predict each day's pass times.
Bob, WB4APR
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Robert
Bruninga
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 12:56 PM To: 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite
Predictor)
I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever capacity I can. I run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Seeing your message, caused me to stop and think, what is the next thing I think might be valuable to help the general
amateur
radio operators to better operate the satellites? Again, this might not be at all what you are interested in, but let me
have
a go at defining a nice project for someone in case this fits anyone's talents.
PROBLEM: To play satellites, you need to have a tracking program and to WATCH it all the time or do PLANNING to know
when
to go play satellites. Actually, this is so... Past decade.
OBJECTIVE: What we need is a "service" that continuously
feeds
SAT-IN-VIEW information to everyone in the field right there
on
their radio front panel, whenever any AMSAT is in view. This way, you can be mobile, or hiking, or anywhere on the planet, and right their even without ASKING, the information will be PUSHED to you.
SOLUTION: Actually, this capability has existed since about 1997 on the APRS channel, but it only works where a LOCAL individual runs either APRSdata or DIGI_NED in the local
region,
and maintains it. In this case, mobiles, or anyone monitoring the national APRS channel will receive this INSTANT
information
not only showing any SAT in view, but also its AZIMUTH, ELEVATION and FREQUENCY of both the uplink and downlink AND DOPPLER!
You can see examples of this system on http://www.aprs.org/localinfo.html . Move your slider about
90%
down the page and look for the paragraph LOCAL SATELLITE
ALERTS.
This way you don't need any PC, or anything. But if you are mobile and if a satellite comes above the horizon in your
area,
and you monitor APRS on your APRS mobile radio, then you will
be
able to work the satellite (also mobile, since we only output the satellites that are easy to work from a mobile)... The
info
on the satellite is updated once each minute when it is above the horizon.
Also, once each TEN minutes a SCHEDULE of any satellites
coming
up in the next 80 minutes is transmitted to the DX LIST inside your radio, so you can also check for any future passes.
PROJECT: Rather than having to have 1000 volunteers all over the world, one in the footprint of every APRS local area have
to
operate and maintain one of these programs (which is why most people never see these alerts), it would be nice if there was just ONE central server that fed this data everywhere. Then only one person would have to update the server when new satellites were launched and once every week or so to download new TLE element sets.
ISSUES: In one sense this would be a great step forward, in centralizing the generation of this data. But the problem is, that it still will not go from the APRS-internet stream back
to
local RF in each local area, unless a local Igate operator
adds
the "server" to his gate-to-RF list. But at least that is
much
simpler than having to maintain a program. Local AMSAT mobiles who want this feed, just ask their local Igate operator to add the server, and from then on, whenever mobile, they will see these alerts.
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a
satellite,
even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a
satellite
in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its Doppler, right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
See the web page for what these displays look like on an APRS radio:
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings:
Hi Bob, I think the following site does pretty much what you are asking http://www.heavens-above.com/
If you register there and input your location one of the options is to display a list of Amateur Satellites for a 24 hour period. It does list all passes and not just the best. You can use the next button to select the following days. The site developer Chris Peat is very helpful, I am sure he could tweak the page to better suite our needs
Steve G6UIM
-----Original Message----- From: Robert Bruninga [mailto:bruninga@usna.edu] Sent: 20 October 2009 18:06 To: bruninga@usna.edu; 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite PAPER Predictor)
Actually, There is another similar WEB page project That does the same thing for ALL mobile operators, Not just those with APRS displays. It is simpler And only has a single TEXT output:
Please see the idea on this web page: http://www.aprs.org/MobileLEOtracking.html
PROJECT OBJECTIVE: Develop a web page that any amateur radio operator can go to that will print out this very simple PAPER tracking device. It is just a piece of paper with 5 columns for each of 5 days, and on each of those five days, the TIME of the best overhead pass for that users local area (morning and evening). For ECHO (AO51) this simple piece of paper with 10 times on it can be used for SHOWING the pass times of ALL morning and evening passes for the next 2 or 3 months!
You don't need no stinkin computer to always know when AO51 is overhead while you are mobile! Just look at the TIME on the paper for today's date. (ECHO's pass times repeat every 5 days)... Each other satellite has similar REPEATABILITY. Just pring one of these slips of papwer for your favorite satellite, and you will never need to do a prediciton again, yet, will always hve what you need in the car to predict each day's pass times.
Bob, WB4APR
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Robert
Bruninga
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 12:56 PM To: 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite
Predictor)
I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever capacity I can. I run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Seeing your message, caused me to stop and think, what is the next thing I think might be valuable to help the general
amateur
radio operators to better operate the satellites? Again, this might not be at all what you are interested in, but let me
have
a go at defining a nice project for someone in case this fits anyone's talents.
PROBLEM: To play satellites, you need to have a tracking program and to WATCH it all the time or do PLANNING to know
when
to go play satellites. Actually, this is so... Past decade.
OBJECTIVE: What we need is a "service" that continuously
feeds
SAT-IN-VIEW information to everyone in the field right there
on
their radio front panel, whenever any AMSAT is in view. This way, you can be mobile, or hiking, or anywhere on the planet, and right their even without ASKING, the information will be PUSHED to you.
SOLUTION: Actually, this capability has existed since about 1997 on the APRS channel, but it only works where a LOCAL individual runs either APRSdata or DIGI_NED in the local
region,
and maintains it. In this case, mobiles, or anyone monitoring the national APRS channel will receive this INSTANT
information
not only showing any SAT in view, but also its AZIMUTH, ELEVATION and FREQUENCY of both the uplink and downlink AND DOPPLER!
You can see examples of this system on http://www.aprs.org/localinfo.html . Move your slider about
90%
down the page and look for the paragraph LOCAL SATELLITE
ALERTS.
This way you don't need any PC, or anything. But if you are mobile and if a satellite comes above the horizon in your
area,
and you monitor APRS on your APRS mobile radio, then you will
be
able to work the satellite (also mobile, since we only output the satellites that are easy to work from a mobile)... The
info
on the satellite is updated once each minute when it is above the horizon.
Also, once each TEN minutes a SCHEDULE of any satellites
coming
up in the next 80 minutes is transmitted to the DX LIST inside your radio, so you can also check for any future passes.
PROJECT: Rather than having to have 1000 volunteers all over the world, one in the footprint of every APRS local area have
to
operate and maintain one of these programs (which is why most people never see these alerts), it would be nice if there was just ONE central server that fed this data everywhere. Then only one person would have to update the server when new satellites were launched and once every week or so to download new TLE element sets.
ISSUES: In one sense this would be a great step forward, in centralizing the generation of this data. But the problem is, that it still will not go from the APRS-internet stream back
to
local RF in each local area, unless a local Igate operator
adds
the "server" to his gate-to-RF list. But at least that is
much
simpler than having to maintain a program. Local AMSAT mobiles who want this feed, just ask their local Igate operator to add the server, and from then on, whenever mobile, they will see these alerts.
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a
satellite,
even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a
satellite
in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its Doppler, right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
See the web page for what these displays look like on an APRS radio:
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings:
Hi Bob, I think the following site does pretty much what you are asking http://www.heavens-above.com/
If you register there and input your location one of the options is to display a list of Amateur Satellites for a 24 hour period. It does list all passes and not just the best. You can use the next button to select the following days. The site developer Chris Peat is very helpful, I am sure he could tweak the page to better suite our needs
Steve G6UIM
-----Original Message----- From: Robert Bruninga [mailto:bruninga@usna.edu] Sent: 20 October 2009 18:06 To: bruninga@usna.edu; 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite PAPER Predictor)
Actually, There is another similar WEB page project That does the same thing for ALL mobile operators, Not just those with APRS displays. It is simpler And only has a single TEXT output:
Please see the idea on this web page: http://www.aprs.org/MobileLEOtracking.html
PROJECT OBJECTIVE: Develop a web page that any amateur radio operator can go to that will print out this very simple PAPER tracking device. It is just a piece of paper with 5 columns for each of 5 days, and on each of those five days, the TIME of the best overhead pass for that users local area (morning and evening). For ECHO (AO51) this simple piece of paper with 10 times on it can be used for SHOWING the pass times of ALL morning and evening passes for the next 2 or 3 months!
You don't need no stinkin computer to always know when AO51 is overhead while you are mobile! Just look at the TIME on the paper for today's date. (ECHO's pass times repeat every 5 days)... Each other satellite has similar REPEATABILITY. Just pring one of these slips of papwer for your favorite satellite, and you will never need to do a prediciton again, yet, will always hve what you need in the car to predict each day's pass times.
Bob, WB4APR
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Robert
Bruninga
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 12:56 PM To: 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite
Predictor)
I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever capacity I can. I run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Seeing your message, caused me to stop and think, what is the next thing I think might be valuable to help the general
amateur
radio operators to better operate the satellites? Again, this might not be at all what you are interested in, but let me
have
a go at defining a nice project for someone in case this fits anyone's talents.
PROBLEM: To play satellites, you need to have a tracking program and to WATCH it all the time or do PLANNING to know
when
to go play satellites. Actually, this is so... Past decade.
OBJECTIVE: What we need is a "service" that continuously
feeds
SAT-IN-VIEW information to everyone in the field right there
on
their radio front panel, whenever any AMSAT is in view. This way, you can be mobile, or hiking, or anywhere on the planet, and right their even without ASKING, the information will be PUSHED to you.
SOLUTION: Actually, this capability has existed since about 1997 on the APRS channel, but it only works where a LOCAL individual runs either APRSdata or DIGI_NED in the local
region,
and maintains it. In this case, mobiles, or anyone monitoring the national APRS channel will receive this INSTANT
information
not only showing any SAT in view, but also its AZIMUTH, ELEVATION and FREQUENCY of both the uplink and downlink AND DOPPLER!
You can see examples of this system on http://www.aprs.org/localinfo.html . Move your slider about
90%
down the page and look for the paragraph LOCAL SATELLITE
ALERTS.
This way you don't need any PC, or anything. But if you are mobile and if a satellite comes above the horizon in your
area,
and you monitor APRS on your APRS mobile radio, then you will
be
able to work the satellite (also mobile, since we only output the satellites that are easy to work from a mobile)... The
info
on the satellite is updated once each minute when it is above the horizon.
Also, once each TEN minutes a SCHEDULE of any satellites
coming
up in the next 80 minutes is transmitted to the DX LIST inside your radio, so you can also check for any future passes.
PROJECT: Rather than having to have 1000 volunteers all over the world, one in the footprint of every APRS local area have
to
operate and maintain one of these programs (which is why most people never see these alerts), it would be nice if there was just ONE central server that fed this data everywhere. Then only one person would have to update the server when new satellites were launched and once every week or so to download new TLE element sets.
ISSUES: In one sense this would be a great step forward, in centralizing the generation of this data. But the problem is, that it still will not go from the APRS-internet stream back
to
local RF in each local area, unless a local Igate operator
adds
the "server" to his gate-to-RF list. But at least that is
much
simpler than having to maintain a program. Local AMSAT mobiles who want this feed, just ask their local Igate operator to add the server, and from then on, whenever mobile, they will see these alerts.
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a
satellite,
even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a
satellite
in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its Doppler, right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
See the web page for what these displays look like on an APRS radio:
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings:
http://ibcnu.us/ APRS on the iPhone
http://www.apptism.com/apps?query=prosat sat tracking on the iPhone
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Steve Daniels Sent: October 20, 2009 2:59 PM To: bruninga@usna.edu Cc: amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite PAPER Predictor)
Hi Bob, I think the following site does pretty much what you are asking http://www.heavens-above.com/
If you register there and input your location one of the options is to display a list of Amateur Satellites for a 24 hour period. It does list all passes and not just the best. You can use the next button to select the following days. The site developer Chris Peat is very helpful, I am sure he could tweak the page to better suite our needs
Steve G6UIM
-----Original Message----- From: Robert Bruninga [mailto:bruninga@usna.edu] Sent: 20 October 2009 18:06 To: bruninga@usna.edu; 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite PAPER Predictor)
Actually, There is another similar WEB page project That does the same thing for ALL mobile operators, Not just those with APRS displays. It is simpler And only has a single TEXT output:
Please see the idea on this web page: http://www.aprs.org/MobileLEOtracking.html
PROJECT OBJECTIVE: Develop a web page that any amateur radio operator can go to that will print out this very simple PAPER tracking device. It is just a piece of paper with 5 columns for each of 5 days, and on each of those five days, the TIME of the best overhead pass for that users local area (morning and evening). For ECHO (AO51) this simple piece of paper with 10 times on it can be used for SHOWING the pass times of ALL morning and evening passes for the next 2 or 3 months!
You don't need no stinkin computer to always know when AO51 is overhead while you are mobile! Just look at the TIME on the paper for today's date. (ECHO's pass times repeat every 5 days)... Each other satellite has similar REPEATABILITY. Just pring one of these slips of papwer for your favorite satellite, and you will never need to do a prediciton again, yet, will always hve what you need in the car to predict each day's pass times.
Bob, WB4APR
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Robert
Bruninga
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 12:56 PM To: 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite
Predictor)
I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever
capacity I can. I
run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Seeing your message, caused me to stop and think, what is the next thing I think might be valuable to help the general
amateur
radio operators to better operate the satellites? Again,
this might
not be at all what you are interested in, but let me
have
a go at defining a nice project for someone in case this
fits anyone's
talents.
PROBLEM: To play satellites, you need to have a tracking
program and
to WATCH it all the time or do PLANNING to know
when
to go play satellites. Actually, this is so... Past decade.
OBJECTIVE: What we need is a "service" that continuously
feeds
SAT-IN-VIEW information to everyone in the field right there
on
their radio front panel, whenever any AMSAT is in view.
This way, you
can be mobile, or hiking, or anywhere on the planet, and
right their
even without ASKING, the information will be PUSHED to you.
SOLUTION: Actually, this capability has existed since about 1997 on the APRS channel, but it only works where a LOCAL
individual
runs either APRSdata or DIGI_NED in the local
region,
and maintains it. In this case, mobiles, or anyone monitoring the national APRS channel will receive this INSTANT
information
not only showing any SAT in view, but also its AZIMUTH,
ELEVATION and
FREQUENCY of both the uplink and downlink AND DOPPLER!
You can see examples of this system on http://www.aprs.org/localinfo.html . Move your slider about
90%
down the page and look for the paragraph LOCAL SATELLITE
ALERTS.
This way you don't need any PC, or anything. But if you are mobile and if a satellite comes above the horizon in your
area,
and you monitor APRS on your APRS mobile radio, then you will
be
able to work the satellite (also mobile, since we only output the satellites that are easy to work from a mobile)... The
info
on the satellite is updated once each minute when it is above the horizon.
Also, once each TEN minutes a SCHEDULE of any satellites
coming
up in the next 80 minutes is transmitted to the DX LIST inside your radio, so you can also check for any future passes.
PROJECT: Rather than having to have 1000 volunteers all over the world, one in the footprint of every APRS local area have
to
operate and maintain one of these programs (which is why
most people
never see these alerts), it would be nice if there was just ONE central server that fed this data everywhere. Then only one person would have to update the server when new satellites were
launched and
once every week or so to download new TLE element sets.
ISSUES: In one sense this would be a great step forward, in centralizing the generation of this data. But the problem
is, that it
still will not go from the APRS-internet stream back
to
local RF in each local area, unless a local Igate operator
adds
the "server" to his gate-to-RF list. But at least that is
much
simpler than having to maintain a program. Local AMSAT mobiles who want this feed, just ask their local Igate operator to add the server, and from then on, whenever mobile, they will see these alerts.
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a
satellite,
even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a
satellite
in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its
Doppler,
right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
See the web page for what these displays look like on an APRS radio:
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings:
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I think the following site does pretty much what you are asking http://www.heavens-above.com/
Actually, that is really quite different. That does what all tracking programs historically do... That is, they produce VOLUMINOUS precise predictions for every pass for every day. TO carry such an output in your car for a month would be about 30 sheets of paper.
The small piece of paper that my proposal outputs is a single piece of paper with about 10 numbers on it, no bigger than about 2" by 3" suitable for taping to your dashboard above your radio. Yet that tiny square of paper can be used to estimate ALL pass times for ECHO (AO51) for one or more months, before needing to be replaced.
Thanks Bob, WB4APR
If you register there and input your location one of the
options is to
display a list of Amateur Satellites for a 24 hour period. It does list all passes and not just the best. You can use the next button to select the following days. The site developer Chris Peat is very helpful, I am sure he could tweak the page to better suite our needs
Steve G6UIM
-----Original Message----- From: Robert Bruninga [mailto:bruninga@usna.edu] Sent: 20 October 2009 18:06 To: bruninga@usna.edu; 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite PAPER Predictor)
Actually, There is another similar WEB page project That does the same thing for ALL mobile operators, Not just those with APRS displays. It is simpler And only has a single TEXT output:
Please see the idea on this web page: http://www.aprs.org/MobileLEOtracking.html
PROJECT OBJECTIVE: Develop a web page that any amateur radio operator can go to that will print out this very simple PAPER tracking device. It is just a piece of paper with 5 columns
for
each of 5 days, and on each of those five days, the TIME of
the
best overhead pass for that users local area (morning and evening). For ECHO (AO51) this simple piece of paper with 10 times on it can be used for SHOWING the pass times of ALL morning and evening passes for the next 2 or 3 months!
You don't need no stinkin computer to always know when AO51 is overhead while you are mobile! Just look at the TIME on the paper for today's date. (ECHO's pass times repeat every 5 days)... Each other satellite has similar REPEATABILITY.
Just
pring one of these slips of papwer for your favorite
satellite,
and you will never need to do a prediciton again, yet, will always hve what you need in the car to predict each day's pass times.
Bob, WB4APR
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Robert
Bruninga
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 12:56 PM To: 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite
Predictor)
I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever capacity I can. I run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Seeing your message, caused me to stop and think, what is
the
next thing I think might be valuable to help the general
amateur
radio operators to better operate the satellites? Again,
this
might not be at all what you are interested in, but let me
have
a go at defining a nice project for someone in case this
fits
anyone's talents.
PROBLEM: To play satellites, you need to have a tracking program and to WATCH it all the time or do PLANNING to know
when
to go play satellites. Actually, this is so... Past decade.
OBJECTIVE: What we need is a "service" that continuously
feeds
SAT-IN-VIEW information to everyone in the field right there
on
their radio front panel, whenever any AMSAT is in view.
This
way, you can be mobile, or hiking, or anywhere on the
planet,
and right their even without ASKING, the information will be PUSHED to you.
SOLUTION: Actually, this capability has existed since about 1997 on the APRS channel, but it only works where a LOCAL individual runs either APRSdata or DIGI_NED in the local
region,
and maintains it. In this case, mobiles, or anyone
monitoring
the national APRS channel will receive this INSTANT
information
not only showing any SAT in view, but also its AZIMUTH, ELEVATION and FREQUENCY of both the uplink and downlink AND DOPPLER!
You can see examples of this system on http://www.aprs.org/localinfo.html . Move your slider about
90%
down the page and look for the paragraph LOCAL SATELLITE
ALERTS.
This way you don't need any PC, or anything. But if you are mobile and if a satellite comes above the horizon in your
area,
and you monitor APRS on your APRS mobile radio, then you
will
be
able to work the satellite (also mobile, since we only
output
the satellites that are easy to work from a mobile)... The
info
on the satellite is updated once each minute when it is
above
the horizon.
Also, once each TEN minutes a SCHEDULE of any satellites
coming
up in the next 80 minutes is transmitted to the DX LIST
inside
your radio, so you can also check for any future passes.
PROJECT: Rather than having to have 1000 volunteers all
over
the world, one in the footprint of every APRS local area
have
to
operate and maintain one of these programs (which is why
most
people never see these alerts), it would be nice if there
was
just ONE central server that fed this data everywhere. Then only one person would have to update the server when new satellites were launched and once every week or so to
download
new TLE element sets.
ISSUES: In one sense this would be a great step forward, in centralizing the generation of this data. But the problem
is,
that it still will not go from the APRS-internet stream back
to
local RF in each local area, unless a local Igate operator
adds
the "server" to his gate-to-RF list. But at least that is
much
simpler than having to maintain a program. Local AMSAT mobiles who want this feed, just ask their local Igate operator to add the server, and from then on, whenever mobile, they will see these alerts.
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a
satellite,
even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a
satellite
in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its Doppler, right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
See the web page for what these displays look like on an
APRS
radio:
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of
the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings:
Hi all,
How about a compromise? There's an old DOS program that I used many years ago that printed out a chart, one line per satellite per pass, sorted by time. One page would hold several days worth, depending on how many satellites you wanted to track. Not as compact as the chart I think Bob has in mind, but just enough detail to work out when to start waving the aluminum around. I used to run it for the month and save the output on my palmtop, for handy reference.
The program was PCTSCAN.EXE, part of the PCTrack package (PCT214). It has some Y2K issues, but I've got a patch program that I think still works to fix the database. I've got the program and such posted on my web site, if you're interested. http://home.wavecable.com/~ko6th, about 1/3 of the way down the screen (31 March, 2002).
The output looks like this:
P C T S C A N PC-Track Satellite Pass Summary Utility Version 1.0 12/2/91 Copyright (c) 1991 Thomas C. Johnson
Scan Report for Auburn
OBJECT AOS AOS CPA MAX LOS TIME IN PASS NAME DATE TIME TIME ELEV TIME RANGE DIRECTION (LOCAL) (LOCAL) (LOCAL) (LOCAL) --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- AO-27 10/19/2009 17:07:22 17:15:11 80.1 17:22:32 00:15:09 NORTHWARD ISS 10/19/2009 18:40:09 18:44:17 24.8 18:48:10 00:08:01 SOUTHWARD AO-27 10/19/2009 18:49:33 18:55:20 9.9 19:00:47 00:11:13 NORTHWARD AO-16 10/19/2009 18:54:49 19:01:52 23.7 19:08:29 00:13:39 NORTHWARD ISS 10/19/2009 19:57:37 20:01:59 45.2 20:06:05 00:08:28 SOUTHWARD AO-16 10/19/2009 20:33:22 20:40:58 41.0 20:48:07 00:14:44 NORTHWARD ISS 10/19/2009 21:16:15 21:20:07 14.4 21:23:44 00:07:28 SOUTHWARD FO-29 10/19/2009 21:18:24 21:26:38 33.3 21:35:46 00:17:21 SOUTHWARD AO-16 10/19/2009 22:19:02 22:21:18 1.0 22:23:21 00:04:19 NORTHWARD ISS 10/19/2009 22:35:11 22:38:38 8.8 22:41:51 00:06:40 SOUTHWARD GO-32 10/19/2009 22:37:10 22:43:17 12.6 22:49:02 00:11:51 NORTHWARD FO-29 10/19/2009 23:03:34 23:11:40 39.5 23:20:46 00:17:12 SOUTHWARD ISS 10/19/2009 23:53:33 23:57:11 11.2 00:00:35 00:07:01 SOUTHWARD GO-32 10/20/2009 00:14:38 00:22:35 79.8 00:30:04 00:15:25 NORTHWARD FO-29 10/20/2009 00:51:08 00:55:26 3.9 00:59:40 00:08:31 SOUTHWARD ISS 10/20/2009 01:11:18 01:15:29 27.1 01:19:25 00:08:06 SOUTHWARD GO-32 10/20/2009 01:57:36 02:03:16 8.8 02:08:35 00:10:58 NORTHWARD ISS 10/20/2009 02:29:04 02:33:21 48.4 02:37:21 00:08:17 SOUTHWARD ISS 10/20/2009 03:47:40 03:50:42 6.6 03:53:32 00:05:51 SOUTHWARD AO-10 10/20/2009 04:13:01 11:27:40 50.1 14:27:47 10:14:45 SOUTHWARD AO-27 10/20/2009 05:21:53 05:29:28 36.0 05:36:36 00:14:43 SOUTHWARD AO-27 10/20/2009 07:01:41 07:08:53 27.0 07:15:40 00:13:58 SOUTHWARD AO-16 10/20/2009 07:08:19 07:13:37 7.6 07:18:36 00:10:16 SOUTHWARD FO-29 10/20/2009 07:33:19 07:38:47 8.9 07:43:55 00:10:36 NORTHWARD AO-27 10/20/2009 08:45:19 08:46:33 0.2 08:47:41 00:02:21 SOUTHWARD AO-16 10/20/2009 08:46:03 08:53:49 77.7 09:01:08 00:15:05 SOUTHWARD FO-29 10/20/2009 09:15:09 09:23:00 79.9 09:30:23 00:15:13 NORTHWARD AO-16 10/20/2009 10:26:18 10:32:26 13.1 10:38:12 00:11:53 SOUTHWARD GO-32 10/20/2009 10:56:30 10:58:58 1.2 11:01:15 00:04:44 SOUTHWARD FO-29 10/20/2009 11:03:04 11:08:46 9.3 11:14:08 00:11:04 NORTHWARD GO-32 10/20/2009 12:32:35 12:40:21 41.6 12:47:40 00:15:04 SOUTHWARD GO-32 10/20/2009 14:12:55 14:20:05 24.3 14:26:49 00:13:53 SOUTHWARD AO-27 10/20/2009 15:04:09 15:08:25 4.7 15:12:26 00:08:16 NORTHWARD AO-27 10/20/2009 16:39:11 16:46:49 46.8 16:54:00 00:14:49 NORTHWARD
Greg KO6TH
From: bruninga@usna.edu To: steve@daniels270.eclipse.co.uk Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 21:02:44 -0400 CC: amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite PAPER Predictor)
I think the following site does pretty much what you are asking http://www.heavens-above.com/
Actually, that is really quite different. That does what all tracking programs historically do... That is, they produce VOLUMINOUS precise predictions for every pass for every day. TO carry such an output in your car for a month would be about 30 sheets of paper.
The small piece of paper that my proposal outputs is a single piece of paper with about 10 numbers on it, no bigger than about 2" by 3" suitable for taping to your dashboard above your radio. Yet that tiny square of paper can be used to estimate ALL pass times for ECHO (AO51) for one or more months, before needing to be replaced.
Thanks Bob, WB4APR
If you register there and input your location one of the
options is to
display a list of Amateur Satellites for a 24 hour period. It does list all passes and not just the best. You can use the next button to select the following days. The site developer Chris Peat is very helpful, I am sure he could tweak the page to better suite our needs
Steve G6UIM
-----Original Message----- From: Robert Bruninga [mailto:bruninga@usna.edu] Sent: 20 October 2009 18:06 To: bruninga@usna.edu; 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite PAPER Predictor)
Actually, There is another similar WEB page project That does the same thing for ALL mobile operators, Not just those with APRS displays. It is simpler And only has a single TEXT output:
Please see the idea on this web page: http://www.aprs.org/MobileLEOtracking.html
PROJECT OBJECTIVE: Develop a web page that any amateur radio operator can go to that will print out this very simple PAPER tracking device. It is just a piece of paper with 5 columns
for
each of 5 days, and on each of those five days, the TIME of
the
best overhead pass for that users local area (morning and evening). For ECHO (AO51) this simple piece of paper with 10 times on it can be used for SHOWING the pass times of ALL morning and evening passes for the next 2 or 3 months!
You don't need no stinkin computer to always know when AO51 is overhead while you are mobile! Just look at the TIME on the paper for today's date. (ECHO's pass times repeat every 5 days)... Each other satellite has similar REPEATABILITY.
Just
pring one of these slips of papwer for your favorite
satellite,
and you will never need to do a prediciton again, yet, will always hve what you need in the car to predict each day's pass times.
Bob, WB4APR
-----Original Message----- From: amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] On Behalf Of Robert
Bruninga
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 12:56 PM To: 'Steve Daniels'; amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: volunteering (Mobile Satellite
Predictor)
I would like to volunteer to help out in whatever capacity I can. I run my own web server built by myself and a few websites.
Seeing your message, caused me to stop and think, what is
the
next thing I think might be valuable to help the general
amateur
radio operators to better operate the satellites? Again,
this
might not be at all what you are interested in, but let me
have
a go at defining a nice project for someone in case this
fits
anyone's talents.
PROBLEM: To play satellites, you need to have a tracking program and to WATCH it all the time or do PLANNING to know
when
to go play satellites. Actually, this is so... Past decade.
OBJECTIVE: What we need is a "service" that continuously
feeds
SAT-IN-VIEW information to everyone in the field right there
on
their radio front panel, whenever any AMSAT is in view.
This
way, you can be mobile, or hiking, or anywhere on the
planet,
and right their even without ASKING, the information will be PUSHED to you.
SOLUTION: Actually, this capability has existed since about 1997 on the APRS channel, but it only works where a LOCAL individual runs either APRSdata or DIGI_NED in the local
region,
and maintains it. In this case, mobiles, or anyone
monitoring
the national APRS channel will receive this INSTANT
information
not only showing any SAT in view, but also its AZIMUTH, ELEVATION and FREQUENCY of both the uplink and downlink AND DOPPLER!
You can see examples of this system on http://www.aprs.org/localinfo.html . Move your slider about
90%
down the page and look for the paragraph LOCAL SATELLITE
ALERTS.
This way you don't need any PC, or anything. But if you are mobile and if a satellite comes above the horizon in your
area,
and you monitor APRS on your APRS mobile radio, then you
will
be
able to work the satellite (also mobile, since we only
output
the satellites that are easy to work from a mobile)... The
info
on the satellite is updated once each minute when it is
above
the horizon.
Also, once each TEN minutes a SCHEDULE of any satellites
coming
up in the next 80 minutes is transmitted to the DX LIST
inside
your radio, so you can also check for any future passes.
PROJECT: Rather than having to have 1000 volunteers all
over
the world, one in the footprint of every APRS local area
have
to
operate and maintain one of these programs (which is why
most
people never see these alerts), it would be nice if there
was
just ONE central server that fed this data everywhere. Then only one person would have to update the server when new satellites were launched and once every week or so to
download
new TLE element sets.
ISSUES: In one sense this would be a great step forward, in centralizing the generation of this data. But the problem
is,
that it still will not go from the APRS-internet stream back
to
local RF in each local area, unless a local Igate operator
adds
the "server" to his gate-to-RF list. But at least that is
much
simpler than having to maintain a program. Local AMSAT mobiles who want this feed, just ask their local Igate operator to add the server, and from then on, whenever mobile, they will see these alerts.
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a
satellite,
even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a
satellite
in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its Doppler, right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
See the web page for what these displays look like on an
APRS
radio:
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of
the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings:
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222984/direct/01/
On Tue, 2009-10-20 at 12:56 -0400, Robert Bruninga wrote:
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a satellite, even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a satellite in view, its direction and elevation, its frequency and its Doppler, right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
Bob, I am one in total agreement with you on this one. We can all get this information on the iPhone, (and maybe other smart phones), our netbooks, laptops and our desktops. But while driving down the road at 60 or so miles per hour and seeing a current FM sat come up on my D-710/700 in the footprint via RF with an elevation and azimuth that is currently workable is the ultimate solution in my mind.
I am one of those 1,000's of operators worldwide you referenced transmitting current satellite positions on a local network, in my case via digi_ned on our local UHF alt-net running on 440.800Mhz at 9.6kbaud within a portion of NWAPRS coverage area (Puget Sound). Within this coverage area it works great, its so nice to glance down at the display and see AO-51 (or others) to the west and over 30 degrees, I hit PM3 and listen to the pass. Sometimes, I even make a contact or two.
You have defined the problem very well, when mobile and outside the footprint of a repeater providing this information ..... well what do you do, your only option is to revert back to the internet. Not the ideal solution in my mind. I like RF, thats why I am an amateur radio operator. I am not smart enough to provide a solution. But, it seems to me, that if local igates do not gate these types of packets back to RF in their operational area then the only solution is for us 1,000's of digi operators worldwide to provide this information in each of our operating areas.
I always enjoy reading your posts Bob ...... Thanks for all you do
73 kim
RESULT: Every mobile everywhere that is in view of a satellite, even without any prior planning, will be alerted to a satellite in view... right there on the front panel of his APRS radio.
... I am one in total agreement... I am one of those... Operators... transmitting current satellite positions on a local network, in my case via digi_ned on our local UHF APRS alt-net running on 440.800Mhz at 9.6kbaud within a portion of NWAPRS coverage area (Puget Sound).
What would be neat is a survey of how many other locations are doing this. One way to do it is to watch the APRS-IS for AO51 objects and see where they are coming from. Of course, they will all overwrite and replace each other, but if one monitors over a reasonable period, then we might see each such system in turn when the AO51 is overhead.
Would you have time to watch the APRS-IS and see if you can find other systems doing this? Then we can make a MAP of the world where this information is available and encourage others to consider putting it out.
Thanks Bob, WB4APR
Kim, AC7YY has taken a survey of the APRS-IS to find out what other areas have Satellite Tracking engines that are putting out live satellite-objects onto the local APRS information channel. It appears there are only two other USA systems and the rest are overseas.
CALL LATITUDE K3PDK-1 39°37'N 77°45'W WD5EAE-3 32°35'N 94°48'W YYDIGI 46°43'N 122°57'W SP8RSL 51°18'N 21°55'E EB1DBX 43°25'N 8°12'W F6KLI-4 44°54'N 0°15'W SKAGIT 48°25'N 122°19'W LW2DVM-1 34°29'S 58°32'W AB9FT-10 43°44'N 87°43'W HB9MM-4 46°42'N 6°24'E F5ZQB-3 42°43'N 1°42'E PD2RLD-2 53°11'N 5°33'E
Where these systems run, the result is every mobile in that area, even without any prior planning, will be alerted to any FM satellite in view, including the frequency, uplink and downlink plus doppler direction and range... right there on the front panel of his APRS radio. Offering a come-as-you are capability for any one mobile to operate when the satellite is in view.
Kim operates his system (digi_ned) on the local UHF APRS alt-net running on 440.800Mhz at 9.6kbaud within a portion of NWAPRS coverage area (Puget Sound). This is a great way to get other mobiles involved in mobile satellite operation. For example, when AO51 comes over it is easy to hear for the central few minues of the pass when the range is indicated below 1000km. Or when ISS comes over and is in packet mode, then a quick mobile QSY from the APRS channel to 145.825 satellite channel allows some packet operation.
Bob, WB4APR
participants (5)
-
Alan VE4YZ -
Greg D. -
kim -
Robert Bruninga -
Steve Daniels