Maybe now would be a good time for someone to write an artical for QST on how to work the birds!
Perhaps send an email to the new satellite ops explaining to them proper way ( BE A MENTOR )
Something needs to be done thats for sure
WA4HFN Damon em55
Problem is Damon, is that some of the worse offenders are guys who've been around ever since I have been. Everyone out to get that elusive Grid Square that they've worked a zillion times before. I too did the same as you, and pretty much void the FM'er anymore, unless something special comes up.
For another 2 cents worth: (I know I'll get flamed) If there is some station announcing here on the BB that they are going to a special grid location that is rare or needed by someone, then give them and others a break. Namely, if he or even any other station that is working Portable or HT status, work him, then QRT, and leave the freq for others. 'Hogging' the channel, working or calling the same old station you've worked a zillion times before and not letting others work the Portable/HT stations, just to satisfy your QSO count for more wallpaper just doesnt hack it, in my opinion. end of rant & extinguisher in hand.............
John W6ZKH DM06 Linears 99% of the time.....now
________________________________ From: "wa4hfn@comcast.net" wa4hfn@comcast.net To: AMSAT amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Mon, January 10, 2011 11:40:10 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Sat protocol
Maybe now would be a good time for someone to write an artical for QST on how to work the birds!
Perhaps send an email to the new satellite ops explaining to them proper way ( BE A MENTOR )
Something needs to be done thats for sure
WA4HFN Damon em55 _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
At 12:42 PM 1/10/2011 -0800, w6zkh@att.net wrote:
Problem is Damon, is that some of the worse offenders are guys who've been around ever since I have been. Everyone out to get that elusive Grid Square that they've worked a zillion times before. I too did the same as you, and pretty much void the FM'er anymore, unless something special comes up.
For another 2 cents worth: (I know I'll get flamed) If there is some station announcing here on the BB that they are going to a special grid location that is rare or needed by someone, then give them and others a break. Namely, if he or even any other station that is working Portable or HT status, work him, then QRT, and leave the freq for others. 'Hogging' the channel, working or calling the same old station you've worked a zillion times before and not letting others work the Portable/HT stations, just to satisfy your QSO count for more wallpaper just doesnt hack it, in my opinion. end of rant & extinguisher in hand.............
John
You won't get flamed by everyone, I'll join ya in the fire.
How many times do they actually have to work the SAME grid before it finally counts? LOL
I don't join in but I listen. It's kind of like listening to CB.
KB7ADL
I am new to the satellite world as of 3 years ago. I have read all the posts on the thread/s and I am wondering if there is a ACTUAL satellite protocol or etiquette that could be referenced. I just the common courtesy I have learn over the years of working the bands Or at least I hope I do. If I am offending please let me know as I will others. I try and get on the early passes on the FM birds when it is not so crowded and can a 2 or 3 sentence conversation with guys I have worked before and guys I have not. It is much easier on the linear birds to do that at most any pass. Just my 2 nickles worth but it would be nice to refer someone to a "protocol" when you feel they are not operating in a manner befitting the hobby rather than them just thinking you should mind your own business and butt out..
73, Joe KI4TZ
Vince Fiscus, KB7ADL wrote:
At 12:42 PM 1/10/2011 -0800, w6zkh@att.net wrote:
Problem is Damon, is that some of the worse offenders are guys who've been around ever since I have been. Everyone out to get that elusive Grid Square that they've worked a zillion times before. I too did the same as you, and pretty much void the FM'er anymore, unless something special comes up.
For another 2 cents worth: (I know I'll get flamed) If there is some station announcing here on the BB that they are going to a special grid location that is rare or needed by someone, then give them and others a break. Namely, if he or even any other station that is working Portable or HT status, work him, then QRT, and leave the freq for others. 'Hogging' the channel, working or calling the same old station you've worked a zillion times before and not letting others work the Portable/HT stations, just to satisfy your QSO count for more wallpaper just doesnt hack it, in my opinion. end of rant & extinguisher in hand.............
John
You won't get flamed by everyone, I'll join ya in the fire.
How many times do they actually have to work the SAME grid before it finally counts? LOL
I don't join in but I listen. It's kind of like listening to CB.
KB7ADL
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
On 1/11/2011 2:36 PM, Joe wrote:
I am new to the satellite world as of 3 years ago. I have read all the posts on the thread/s and I am wondering if there is a ACTUAL satellite protocol or etiquette that could be referenced. I just the common courtesy I have learn over the years of working the bands Or at least I hope I do. If I am offending please let me know as I will others. I try and get on the early passes on the FM birds when it is not so crowded and can a 2 or 3 sentence conversation with guys I have worked before and guys I have not. It is much easier on the linear birds to do that at most any pass. Just my 2 nickles worth but it would be nice to refer someone to a "protocol" when you feel they are not operating in a manner befitting the hobby rather than them just thinking you should mind your own business and butt out..
73, Joe KI4TZ
This article is a good one: http://www.innismir.net/article/26 I've emailed it to bad apples and newbies several times in the past.
That being said, all the high power FM satellites have always had the capacity to be a mess. UO-14 was worse than AO-51, partially because it was 4 watts and you could truly work it on an HT antenna. There were passes of UO-14 that sounded like Field Day from beginning to end.
More and more operators are using half duplex systems on the FM satellites, and this really has an impact when things get busy. Listen to enough passes and when things jam up, and you'll figure out who is full duplex, and who can hear well too. All of us need to encourage, by education and example, full duplex operation as soon as possible in an operators station evolution. Equipment is getting harder to find new, but you can find used 2m uplink rigs for dirt cheap used, and almost as much new as you'd save by forgoing the Arrow diplexer!
We should also self-limit our QSOs when it gets busy. Sometimes it can be hard to do. Personally, I tend to get dogpiled a little bit when I get on. I'll answer someone if they call me (usually) but won't initiate more than one or two QSOs, and those are usually new guys I hear. I also often ignore stations who exhibit poor manners and QRM other stations or QSOs. A little passive-aggressive, but it often gets the point across.
73, Drew KO4MA AMSAT-NA VP Operations
I second that last paragraph, Drew...
John W6ZKH
________________________________ From: Andrew Glasbrenner glasbrenner@mindspring.com To: Joe jbarkley@truvista.net Cc: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tue, January 11, 2011 12:28:23 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Sat protocol
On 1/11/2011 2:36 PM, Joe wrote:
I am new to the satellite world as of 3 years ago. I have read all the posts on the thread/s and I am wondering if there is a ACTUAL satellite protocol or etiquette that could be referenced. I just the common courtesy I have learn over the years of working the bands Or at least I hope I do. If I am offending please let me know as I will others. I try and get on the early passes on the FM birds when it is not so crowded and can a 2 or 3 sentence conversation with guys I have worked before and guys I have not. It is much easier on the linear birds to do that at most any pass. Just my 2 nickles worth but it would be nice to refer someone to a "protocol" when you feel they are not operating in a manner befitting the hobby rather than them just thinking you should mind your own business and butt out..
73, Joe KI4TZ
This article is a good one: http://www.innismir.net/article/26 I've emailed it to bad apples and newbies several times in the past.
That being said, all the high power FM satellites have always had the capacity to be a mess. UO-14 was worse than AO-51, partially because it was 4 watts and you could truly work it on an HT antenna. There were passes of UO-14 that sounded like Field Day from beginning to end.
More and more operators are using half duplex systems on the FM satellites, and this really has an impact when things get busy. Listen to enough passes and when things jam up, and you'll figure out who is full duplex, and who can hear well too. All of us need to encourage, by education and example, full duplex operation as soon as possible in an operators station evolution. Equipment is getting harder to find new, but you can find used 2m uplink rigs for dirt cheap used, and almost as much new as you'd save by forgoing the Arrow diplexer!
We should also self-limit our QSOs when it gets busy. Sometimes it can be hard to do. Personally, I tend to get dogpiled a little bit when I get on. I'll answer someone if they call me (usually) but won't initiate more than one or two QSOs, and those are usually new guys I hear. I also often ignore stations who exhibit poor manners and QRM other stations or QSOs. A little passive-aggressive, but it often gets the point across.
73, Drew KO4MA AMSAT-NA VP Operations
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Very Good info Drew, I had not seen this before and will keep it bookmarked to pass along. 73, Joe KI4TZ
Andrew Glasbrenner wrote:
On 1/11/2011 2:36 PM, Joe wrote:
I am new to the satellite world as of 3 years ago. I have read all the posts on the thread/s and I am wondering if there is a ACTUAL satellite protocol or etiquette that could be referenced. I just the common courtesy I have learn over the years of working the bands Or at least I hope I do. If I am offending please let me know as I will others. I try and get on the early passes on the FM birds when it is not so crowded and can a 2 or 3 sentence conversation with guys I have worked before and guys I have not. It is much easier on the linear birds to do that at most any pass. Just my 2 nickles worth but it would be nice to refer someone to a "protocol" when you feel they are not operating in a manner befitting the hobby rather than them just thinking you should mind your own business and butt out..
73, Joe KI4TZ
This article is a good one: http://www.innismir.net/article/26 I've emailed it to bad apples and newbies several times in the past.
That being said, all the high power FM satellites have always had the capacity to be a mess. UO-14 was worse than AO-51, partially because it was 4 watts and you could truly work it on an HT antenna. There were passes of UO-14 that sounded like Field Day from beginning to end.
More and more operators are using half duplex systems on the FM satellites, and this really has an impact when things get busy. Listen to enough passes and when things jam up, and you'll figure out who is full duplex, and who can hear well too. All of us need to encourage, by education and example, full duplex operation as soon as possible in an operators station evolution. Equipment is getting harder to find new, but you can find used 2m uplink rigs for dirt cheap used, and almost as much new as you'd save by forgoing the Arrow diplexer!
We should also self-limit our QSOs when it gets busy. Sometimes it can be hard to do. Personally, I tend to get dogpiled a little bit when I get on. I'll answer someone if they call me (usually) but won't initiate more than one or two QSOs, and those are usually new guys I hear. I also often ignore stations who exhibit poor manners and QRM other stations or QSOs. A little passive-aggressive, but it often gets the point across.
73, Drew KO4MA AMSAT-NA VP Operations
I too am new to satellite operations having made my first QSO on November 24 of last year via AO51 and was immediately identified as a newbie and encouraged and given advice by several with whom I made QSO's. When I decided to get into this mode of operation, like most endeavors I pursue, I read everything I could on the subject. Online and in print the common advice from those offering it is "don't call CQ, do give your call and grid and wait for someone to answer you or call someone who is giving their call and grid, complete the exchange and move on. There seem to be some who make no effort to learn proper operating procedures or just ignore procedure, but a vast majority does seem to follow this type of procedure. What everyone seems to be concerned with are the pileups and common courtesy of not stepping on others and being long winded, which on the FM Birds could be anything above and beyond the exchange. Reconfiguring the Birds to transponder only is not a viable option, unless you wish to exclude newbie’s and oldies who for many reasons can only work the FM repeater mode. Patience with and outreach to any "offender" should be the first order of business, which I will make a concerted effort to do with the next one I can identify. This can be done with an email that courteously offers advice on how to succeed in and enjoy our hobby. A concerted effort from AMSAT is one way of getting the info out, but not all operators are members and I sure AMSAT has done this over the years. Like many activities, self policing through offers of help and advice is the best option. 73, Marvin K5MLT
________________________________ From: Joe jbarkley@truvista.net Cc: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tue, January 11, 2011 1:36:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Sat protocol
I am new to the satellite world as of 3 years ago. I have read all the posts on the thread/s and I am wondering if there is a ACTUAL satellite protocol or etiquette that could be referenced. I just the common courtesy I have learn over the years of working the bands Or at least I hope I do. If I am offending please let me know as I will others. I try and get on the early passes on the FM birds when it is not so crowded and can a 2 or 3 sentence conversation with guys I have worked before and guys I have not. It is much easier on the linear birds to do that at most any pass. Just my 2 nickles worth but it would be nice to refer someone to a "protocol" when you feel they are not operating in a manner befitting the hobby rather than them just thinking you should mind your own business and butt out..
73, Joe KI4TZ
Vince Fiscus, KB7ADL wrote:
At 12:42 PM 1/10/2011 -0800, w6zkh@att.net wrote:
Problem is Damon, is that some of the worse offenders are guys who've been around ever since I have been. Everyone out to get that elusive Grid Square that they've worked a zillion times before. I too did the same as you, and pretty much void the FM'er anymore, unless something special comes up.
For another 2 cents worth: (I know I'll get flamed) If there is some station announcing here on the BB that they are going to a special grid location that is rare or needed by someone, then give them and others a break. Namely, if he or even any other station that is working Portable or HT status, work him, then QRT, and leave the freq for others. 'Hogging' the channel, working or calling the same old station you've worked a zillion times before and not letting others work the Portable/HT stations, just to satisfy your QSO count for more wallpaper just doesnt hack it, in my opinion. end of rant & extinguisher in hand.............
John
You won't get flamed by everyone, I'll join ya in the fire.
How many times do they actually have to work the SAME grid before it finally counts? LOL
I don't join in but I listen. It's kind of like listening to CB.
KB7ADL
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I have talked directly to the editor in chief of QST. I got a "not interested" response
Ron
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 10, 2011, at 1:40 PM, wa4hfn@comcast.net wrote:
Maybe now would be a good time for someone to write an artical for QST on how to work the birds!
Perhaps send an email to the new satellite ops explaining to them proper way ( BE A MENTOR )
Something needs to be done thats for sure
WA4HFN Damon em55 _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Maybe try CQ-VHF? Jim KQ6EA
On 01/10/2011 09:00 PM, rnutter@networkref.com wrote:
I have talked directly to the editor in chief of QST. I got a "not interested" response
Ron
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 10, 2011, at 1:40 PM, wa4hfn@comcast.net wrote:
Maybe now would be a good time for someone to write an artical for QST on how to work the birds!
Perhaps send an email to the new satellite ops explaining to them proper way ( BE A MENTOR )
Something needs to be done thats for sure
WA4HFN Damon em55 _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Does anyone even read that mag?? We need old Wayne Green and 73 magazine back again, I'd just about bet that would work......between 73 and HamRadio mags, they were the BEST ham rags out......too bad they got eaten up.
John W6ZKH
________________________________ From: Jim Jerzycke kq6ea@verizon.net To: "rnutter@networkref.com" rnutter@networkref.com Cc: AMSAT amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Mon, January 10, 2011 1:11:35 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Sat protocol
Maybe try CQ-VHF? Jim KQ6EA
On 01/10/2011 09:00 PM, rnutter@networkref.com wrote:
I have talked directly to the editor in chief of QST. I got a "not interested" response
Ron
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 10, 2011, at 1:40 PM, wa4hfn@comcast.net wrote:
Maybe now would be a good time for someone to write an artical for QST on how to work the birds!
Perhaps send an email to the new satellite ops explaining to them proper way ( BE A MENTOR )
Something needs to be done thats for sure
WA4HFN Damon em55 _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Or the AMSAT Journal.....
Zack KD8KSN
-----Original Message----- From: Jim Jerzycke Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 4:11 PM To: rnutter@networkref.com Cc: AMSAT Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Sat protocol
Maybe try CQ-VHF? Jim KQ6EA
On 01/10/2011 09:00 PM, rnutter@networkref.com wrote:
I have talked directly to the editor in chief of QST. I got a "not interested" response
Ron
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 10, 2011, at 1:40 PM, wa4hfn@comcast.net wrote:
Maybe now would be a good time for someone to write an artical for QST on how to work the birds!
Perhaps send an email to the new satellite ops explaining to them proper way ( BE A MENTOR )
Something needs to be done thats for sure
WA4HFN Damon em55 _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
participants (9)
-
Andrew Glasbrenner -
Jim Jerzycke -
Joe -
John Neeley -
Marvin Tamez -
rnutter＠networkref.com -
Vince Fiscus, KB7ADL -
wa4hfn＠comcast.net -
Zachary Beougher