Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Can that block be treated with a non corrosive lacquer? Sun and weather does a lot of damage.
Gulf Alpha is no longer producing their OSCAR antennas.
Rich W4BUE
----- Original Message ----- From: "WA6FWF" wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I have a set of Gulf Alphas I bought and never put up for sale. As new.
73 Clayton W5PFG On Dec 10, 2013 1:30 PM, "Rich/wa4bue" richard.siff@verizon.net wrote:
Can that block be treated with a non corrosive lacquer? Sun and weather does a lot of damage.
Gulf Alpha is no longer producing their OSCAR antennas.
Rich W4BUE
----- Original Message ----- From: "WA6FWF" wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each
year?
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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Wish I had known before purchasing new antennas for the K4AMG club. >From what I could see they are of better construction. ----- Original Message ----- From: Clayton Coleman To: Rich/wa4bue Cc: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 3:15 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
I have a set of Gulf Alphas I bought and never put up for sale. As new.
73 Clayton W5PFG
On Dec 10, 2013 1:30 PM, "Rich/wa4bue" richard.siff@verizon.net wrote:
Can that block be treated with a non corrosive lacquer? Sun and weather does a lot of damage.
Gulf Alpha is no longer producing their OSCAR antennas.
Rich W4BUE
----- Original Message ----- From: "WA6FWF" wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
________________________________ From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWFOn 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I am not a fan of COAX Seal, it tends to migrate into the connector.
In the Hampton Roads area, a NAVY town, we use the old NAVY way: * Light application of high great Silicon * Double sided electrical tape rap * Electrical tape rap * Spray lacquer over * Nylon tie on each end
Great seal!
----- Original Message ----- From: "WA6FWF" wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:54 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWFOn 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 02:21:50PM -0500, Rich/wa4bue wrote:
I am not a fan of COAX Seal, it tends to migrate into the connector.
In the Hampton Roads area, a NAVY town, we use the old NAVY way:
- Light application of high great Silicon
- Double sided electrical tape rap
- Electrical tape rap
- Spray lacquer over
- Nylon tie on each end
Great seal!
Ew, LX tape. Yuck. Leaves sticky residue when you try to peel it off, loses its sticky and unwraps by itself leaving sticky crap everywhere if you don't.
Get proper rubber self-amagamating tape, and do the job once and do it right.
All, Actually, the M2 antennas don't need weatherproofing. The polarity switching cable/ transformers and baluns are made of RG-6 gel filled with commercial compression connectors. This stuff should be bulletproof. The polarity switch and front driven element are sealed. There is no way (and no reason) to weatherproof them. Norm n3ykf
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 4:42 PM, Gordon JC Pearce gordonjcp@gjcp.netwrote:
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 02:21:50PM -0500, Rich/wa4bue wrote:
I am not a fan of COAX Seal, it tends to migrate into the connector.
In the Hampton Roads area, a NAVY town, we use the old NAVY way:
- Light application of high great Silicon
- Double sided electrical tape rap
- Electrical tape rap
- Spray lacquer over
- Nylon tie on each end
Great seal!
Ew, LX tape. Yuck. Leaves sticky residue when you try to peel it off, loses its sticky and unwraps by itself leaving sticky crap everywhere if you don't.
Get proper rubber self-amagamating tape, and do the job once and do it right.
-- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ (up here at 57°N we get a bit of weather) _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sorry, Yes, the double side is Get proper rubber self-amalgamating tape. Should have said that!
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon JC Pearce" gordonjcp@gjcp.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 4:42 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna Sealing Coax
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 02:21:50PM -0500, Rich/wa4bue wrote:
I am not a fan of COAX Seal, it tends to migrate into the connector.
In the Hampton Roads area, a NAVY town, we use the old NAVY way:
- Light application of high great Silicon
- Double sided electrical tape rap
- Electrical tape rap
- Spray lacquer over
- Nylon tie on each end
Great seal!
Ew, LX tape. Yuck. Leaves sticky residue when you try to peel it off, loses its sticky and unwraps by itself leaving sticky crap everywhere if you don't.
Get proper rubber self-amagamating tape, and do the job once and do it right.
When I lived in Hampton Roads (and was in the Nav) I eventually came on to the following algorithm:
2 layers of good electrical tape 2 layers of coax seal 2 more layers of good electrical tape, each overlapping the under layer.
When I retired from the Navy and took the antennas down, connectors that had been in the air for 15 years looked brand new. An additional bennie, if I had to open one up, just a slit with a knife and I could peel the layers back & get access to the connector. When done, just press back into place and cover with 2 more layers of good tape.
Worked great for me.
Good luck & 73, Jim wb4gcs@amsat.org
On 12/10/2013 2:21 PM, Rich/wa4bue wrote:
I am not a fan of COAX Seal, it tends to migrate into the connector.
In the Hampton Roads area, a NAVY town, we use the old NAVY way:
- Light application of high great Silicon
- Double sided electrical tape rap
- Electrical tape rap
- Spray lacquer over
- Nylon tie on each end
Great seal!
----- Original Message ----- From: "WA6FWF" wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:54 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWFOn 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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Or, you can use the really cheap black plastic tape for weatherproofing. That is, the "no name", "UL approved", tape that is sold by places like Harbor Freight.
Such tape was provided by Decibel Products, and other commercial two-way antenna manufacturers, for decades to weatherproof coaxial cable connections. Every antenna came with a roll of this tape included. Since a single roll of this tape was sufficient to weatherproof a number of connections, every tower man that I ever knew had a large box full of unused rolls of tape. The tape was just too useful to throw away.
The "cheap stuff" congeals into a waterproof mass after a few days in the sun. More expensive tape often comes loose. One does have to cut through the mass to remove the tape. I have removed this tape from antennas that have been several hundred feet in the air, for decades, and, when removed, the connector looked just like it did when new! Glen, K9STH
Website: http://k9sth.com
On Tuesday, December 10, 2013 6:23 PM, Jim Sanford wb4gcs@wb4gcs.org wrote:
When I lived in Hampton Roads (and was in the Nav) I eventually came on to the following algorithm:
2 layers of good electrical tape 2 layers of coax seal 2 more layers of good electrical tape, each overlapping the under layer.
When I retired from the Navy and took the antennas down, connectors that had been in the air for 15 years looked brand new. An additional bennie, if I had to open one up, just a slit with a knife and I could peel the layers back & get access to the connector. When done, just press back into place and cover with 2 more layers of good tape.
Worked great for me.
Good luck & 73, Jim wb4gcs@amsat.org
On 12/10/2013 2:21 PM, Rich/wa4bue wrote:
I am not a fan of COAX Seal, it tends to migrate into the connector.
In the Hampton Roads area, a NAVY town, we use the old NAVY way:
- Light application of high great Silicon
- Double sided electrical tape rap
- Electrical tape rap
- Spray lacquer over
- Nylon tie on each end
Great seal!
----- Original Message ----- From: "WA6FWF" wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:54 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 04:40:26PM -0800, Glen Zook wrote:
The "cheap stuff" congeals into a waterproof mass after a few days in the sun. More expensive tape often comes loose. One does have to cut through the mass to remove the tape. I have removed this tape from antennas that have been several hundred feet in the air, for decades, and, when removed, the connector looked just like it did when new! Glen, K9STH
What I think is fun about the rubber self-amalgamating tape, is when you cut it off if you've put it on right you can see all the manufacturer's engraving on the connectors in relief in the rubber ;-)
I am breaking with my normal practise of not posting to the amsat-bb:
I have a M2 436CP42 which is even larger than the 436CP30. I have had it since about 1999 as it was used for AO-40 uplink. I wired mine in RHCP without the optional polarity switching relay so I have no direct experience with the relay. My antenna has performed just fine in the 14-years it has been mounted outside so the antenna is certainly of good construction. I made no extra protection other than good sealing of coax lines.
The relay in question is probably not manufactured by M2 so quality may not be up to their usual standard? The white plastic obviously was not UV resistant. Instead of bemoaning this just replace it with a good coaxial relay like the CX140 from Tohtsu (or suitable substitute) which you can buy from DEMI, RF Parts and probably many ham dealers.
I wonder if M2 even stocks these relays anymore? No comment on their customer service. You should have heard back from them.
I have several M2 antennas in use: four 2mXP-20 for eme, 436CP42 AND 2m7 for satellite, 420-450-11 for general purpose UHF, and several splitters and other components all which perform well for over a decade in Alaska's wx.
73, Ed - KL7UW
At 09:54 AM 12/10/2013, WA6FWF wrote:
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWFOn 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com dubususa@gmail.com "Kits made by KL7UW"
I am prepared to consider that this is an anomaly. Have a look here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/n3ykf/11312549334/ and feel free to browse the three pictures of the antenna. Told the people at M squared and got nowhere. This is definitely an engineering problem. The issue with the front driven element is that it, too is cracking and it too will fail. Probably sooner than later.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 2:22 PM, Edward R Cole kl7uw@acsalaska.net wrote:
I am breaking with my normal practise of not posting to the amsat-bb:
I have a M2 436CP42 which is even larger than the 436CP30. I have had it since about 1999 as it was used for AO-40 uplink. I wired mine in RHCP without the optional polarity switching relay so I have no direct experience with the relay. My antenna has performed just fine in the 14-years it has been mounted outside so the antenna is certainly of good construction. I made no extra protection other than good sealing of coax lines.
The relay in question is probably not manufactured by M2 so quality may not be up to their usual standard? The white plastic obviously was not UV resistant. Instead of bemoaning this just replace it with a good coaxial relay like the CX140 from Tohtsu (or suitable substitute) which you can buy from DEMI, RF Parts and probably many ham dealers.
I wonder if M2 even stocks these relays anymore? No comment on their customer service. You should have heard back from them.
I have several M2 antennas in use: four 2mXP-20 for eme, 436CP42 AND 2m7 for satellite, 420-450-11 for general purpose UHF, and several splitters and other components all which perform well for over a decade in Alaska's wx.
73, Ed - KL7UW
At 09:54 AM 12/10/2013, WA6FWF wrote:
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWFOn 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com dubususa@gmail.com "Kits made by KL7UW" _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
From the pix, I'd say the UV made the plastic brittle and vibration
from the wind over the elements finally made the cracks. - Bob K8BL
________________________________ From: Lizeth Norman normanlizeth@gmail.com To: Cc: "<,amsat-bb@amsat.org>," amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 2:47 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
I am prepared to consider that this is an anomaly. Have a look here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/n3ykf/11312549334/ and feel free to browse the three pictures of the antenna. Told the people at M squared and got nowhere. This is definitely an engineering problem. The issue with the front driven element is that it, too is cracking and it too will fail. Probably sooner than later.
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 2:22 PM, Edward R Cole kl7uw@acsalaska.net wrote:
I am breaking with my normal practise of not posting to the amsat-bb:
I have a M2 436CP42 which is even larger than the 436CP30. I have had it since about 1999 as it was used for AO-40 uplink. I wired mine in RHCP without the optional polarity switching relay so I have no direct experience with the relay. My antenna has performed just fine in the 14-years it has been mounted outside so the antenna is certainly of good construction. I made no extra protection other than good sealing of coax lines.
The relay in question is probably not manufactured by M2 so quality may not be up to their usual standard? The white plastic obviously was not UV resistant. Instead of bemoaning this just replace it with a good coaxial relay like the CX140 from Tohtsu (or suitable substitute) which you can buy from DEMI, RF Parts and probably many ham dealers.
I wonder if M2 even stocks these relays anymore? No comment on their customer service. You should have heard back from them.
I have several M2 antennas in use: four 2mXP-20 for eme, 436CP42 AND 2m7 for satellite, 420-450-11 for general purpose UHF, and several splitters and other components all which perform well for over a decade in Alaska's wx.
73, Ed - KL7UW
At 09:54 AM 12/10/2013, WA6FWF wrote:
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com/ dubususa@gmail.com "Kits made by KL7UW" _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
On 12/10/2013 1:22 PM, Edward R Cole wrote:
I am breaking with my normal practise of not posting to the amsat-bb:
I have a M2 436CP42 which is even larger than the 436CP30. I have had it since about 1999 as it was used for AO-40 uplink. I wired mine in RHCP without the optional polarity switching relay so I have no direct experience with the relay. My antenna has performed just fine in the 14-years it has been mounted outside so the antenna is certainly of good construction. I made no extra protection other than good sealing of coax lines.
You and me both. As well as many others.
John W0JAB
I have the short pair. Holding up well. They are about 15 years old. Loved them enough to buy other non-satellite yagis ( for satellite use nonetheless!)
Maybe it was bad batch of plastic?!
Mark L. Hammond [N8MH]
On Dec 10, 2013, at 1:54 PM, WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net wrote:
Well I look my antennas over each year but they have always been relatively easy to get at even when they were on a glen martin tower on the roof, I could see every other year if it is a major undertaking but based on his call he is in New York, to think you can put a antenna up and ignore it for years in a area with snow and freezing temps stretches reason.
I'm also a fan of coax seal and some sort of coating on the elements, When I look my antennas over I'm checking for loose bolts and UV damage to plastic parts and coax, out on the west coast it is the Sun and heat that is the thing to worry about.
73 Kevin WA6FWF
On 12/10/2013 10:32 AM, R.T.Liddy wrote: I'm neutral on this topic, but I was curious if the M2 Manual mentioned anything about maintenance. Here are the instructions:
http://www.m2inc.com/pdf_manuals/436CP30.pdf
There is no mention of maintenance. Of course, it would be a good idea to check things out regularly. But, depending on where the antenna is installed, it could be quite difficult to get to it once it's put up. I can't think of anyone that actually does yearly maintenance on their antennas. My rule of thumb is to anticipate what problems could occur and do what's necessary to avoid them during the initial installation. I always use Coax-Seal and spray the heck out of everything with clear Rustoleum.
GL, Bob K8BL
From: WA6FWF wa6fwf@sbcglobal.net To: amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 1:01 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: why not to buy an M2 antenna
Might I ask what sort of preventative maintenance did you perform each year?
73 Kevin WA6FWFOn 12/10/2013 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman wrote: Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
The damage shown in the photos is simply the plastic (my guess is it is Delrin) breaking down from UV exposure. Back in the 80's I built my own circular polarized antennas for 70cm and 2M for AO-13. Having a lathe I made some parts from white Delrin (a nylon like material). After about ten years it showed the same UV damage. Note that the black plastic element insulators in the photos are not cracked. The black pigment used in the element insulators apparently protects them from UV. After learning this lesson I started using the black Delrin for my home brew antennas and have had no problems with UV damage. All that said, some plastics are more resistant to UV than others. I have two M2 antennas in use for terrestrial use and after ten years of being up in the elements they are both working well. Note that the UV damage may not have gone all the way to the core of the component yet. If it is still mechanically intact (and just looks awful), it can be salvaged by coating it with a thick black sealant and covering that with black electrical tape.
--73-- Dave WA0AUQ
Dave, My times technologies T100 says the switching block failed. I am not worried about cosmetics. Cosmetics don't get grid squares. Have fun, Norm n3ykf
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 3:46 PM, David Metz davemetz@machlink.com wrote:
The damage shown in the photos is simply the plastic (my guess is it is Delrin) breaking down from UV exposure. Back in the 80's I built my own circular polarized antennas for 70cm and 2M for AO-13. Having a lathe I made some parts from white Delrin (a nylon like material). After about ten years it showed the same UV damage. Note that the black plastic element insulators in the photos are not cracked. The black pigment used in the element insulators apparently protects them from UV. After learning this lesson I started using the black Delrin for my home brew antennas and have had no problems with UV damage. All that said, some plastics are more resistant to UV than others. I have two M2 antennas in use for terrestrial use and after ten years of being up in the elements they are both working well. Note that the UV damage may not have gone all the way to the core of the component yet. If it is still mechanically intact (and just looks awful), it can be salvaged by coating it with a thick black sealant and covering that with black electrical tape.
--73-- Dave WA0AUQ
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
5 Years??? What's the warranty period?
Jeff Moore -- KE7ACY
On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 8:46 AM, Lizeth Norman normanlizeth@gmail.comwrote:
Purchased a M2 436CP30. Had a failure of the switching block in less than 5 years. White plastic cracked and allowed water to ingress to the switcher. Customer service?? No return call. Pics on request. Norm n3ykf _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
participants (13)
-
Clayton Coleman -
David Metz -
Edward R Cole -
Glen Zook -
Gordon JC Pearce -
Jeff Moore -
Jim Sanford -
John Becker -
Lizeth Norman -
Mark L. Hammond -
R.T.Liddy -
Rich/wa4bue -
WA6FWF