Hi Perry!
AO-92 was kept in U/V mode in order to allow operators more opportunities to work N6O/mm from rare grid DM02. The operation will last only one day.
The decision was announced over the AMSAT Twitter and Facebook accounts. I don't recall or can't find if it was posted on the -BB. Might be a good idea for next time.
73 Fernando KF7R
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019, 12:52 AM Perry Yantis via AMSAT-BB < amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
I stayed up late tonight to work AO92 L/V mode only to find that it was still in L/V mode.Then I got on EO88 a few minutes later and was told that L/V mode would be on Wednesday this week.It would be nice it this information was posted on the BBS BEFORE the weekend gets here.Also why the change anyway????? Perry WB8OTH
py41@att.net sent from my Apple Macbook Pro _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I have been maintaining data resources of this kind for a long time (early 90's).
Recently, I've noticed a tendency for folks to allow commercial enterprises like FB and Twitter replace the more tried and true methods of communication.
In our case, (car clubs) this led to missed opportunities for members that choose not to support commercial enterprise or subject themselves to the potential privacy and security concerns that these Social Media networks expose their 'customers' to.
I love this BB, and I am one of those that has never had a Facebook or Twitter account. I hope that the folks in the know remember that not everyone uses Social Media, and post info where the rest of us can get at is as well.
Best,
- Eli Caul KK6ZHZ
________________________________________ From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org on behalf of Fernando Ramirez via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2019 1:17 To: AMSAT -BB Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??
Hi Perry!
AO-92 was kept in U/V mode in order to allow operators more opportunities to work N6O/mm from rare grid DM02. The operation will last only one day.
The decision was announced over the AMSAT Twitter and Facebook accounts. I don't recall or can't find if it was posted on the -BB. Might be a good idea for next time.
73 Fernando KF7R
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019, 12:52 AM Perry Yantis via AMSAT-BB < amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
I stayed up late tonight to work AO92 L/V mode only to find that it was still in L/V mode.Then I got on EO88 a few minutes later and was told that L/V mode would be on Wednesday this week.It would be nice it this information was posted on the BBS BEFORE the weekend gets here.Also why the change anyway????? Perry WB8OTH
py41@att.net sent from my Apple Macbook Pro _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Hi, rest assured it was an oversight from command stations. Sometimes we get busy with other things (real life) and miss an email. We’ll try to do better. And by “we” I mean the whole command team. KO4MA and me ;)
Hopefully users will cooperate on Tuesday night so we can put into L/v at that time. I’ve been pondering and suggesting a long term swap to Tuesday/utc Wednesday, like we did for many years as Experimenter’s night. There are so many grid events and activations on weekends—seems like a good move to change our schedule so we can have our cake and eat it too!
73, Mark N8MH
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 6:26 PM Eli Caul via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
I have been maintaining data resources of this kind for a long time (early 90's).
Recently, I've noticed a tendency for folks to allow commercial enterprises like FB and Twitter replace the more tried and true methods of communication.
In our case, (car clubs) this led to missed opportunities for members that choose not to support commercial enterprise or subject themselves to the potential privacy and security concerns that these Social Media networks expose their 'customers' to.
I love this BB, and I am one of those that has never had a Facebook or Twitter account. I hope that the folks in the know remember that not everyone uses Social Media, and post info where the rest of us can get at is as well.
Best,
- Eli Caul KK6ZHZ
From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org on behalf of Fernando Ramirez via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2019 1:17 To: AMSAT -BB Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??
Hi Perry!
AO-92 was kept in U/V mode in order to allow operators more opportunities to work N6O/mm from rare grid DM02. The operation will last only one day.
The decision was announced over the AMSAT Twitter and Facebook accounts.
I
don't recall or can't find if it was posted on the -BB. Might be a good idea for next time.
73 Fernando KF7R
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019, 12:52 AM Perry Yantis via AMSAT-BB < amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
I stayed up late tonight to work AO92 L/V mode only to find that it was still in L/V mode.Then I got on EO88 a few minutes later and was told
that
L/V mode would be on Wednesday this week.It would be nice it this information was posted on the BBS BEFORE the weekend gets here.Also why
the
change anyway????? Perry WB8OTH
py41@att.net sent from my Apple Macbook Pro _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Mark, thanks for all your time.
Since you mention the command team, perhaps now might be a good chance to approach other operators that we know have the necessary equipment and ask if they would be willing to be part that team. Same goes with the people who manage the social media accounts.
Have a great week!
73 Fernando, KF7R
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 3:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Hi, rest assured it was an oversight from command stations. Sometimes we get busy with other things (real life) and miss an email. We’ll try to do better. And by “we” I mean the whole command team. KO4MA and me ;)
Hopefully users will cooperate on Tuesday night so we can put into L/v at that time. I’ve been pondering and suggesting a long term swap to Tuesday/utc Wednesday, like we did for many years as Experimenter’s night. There are so many grid events and activations on weekends—seems like a good move to change our schedule so we can have our cake and eat it too!
73, Mark N8MH
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 6:26 PM Eli Caul via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
I have been maintaining data resources of this kind for a long time (early 90's).
Recently, I've noticed a tendency for folks to allow commercial enterprises like FB and Twitter replace the more tried and true methods of communication.
In our case, (car clubs) this led to missed opportunities for members that choose not to support commercial enterprise or subject themselves to the potential privacy and security concerns that these Social Media networks expose their 'customers' to.
I love this BB, and I am one of those that has never had a Facebook or Twitter account. I hope that the folks in the know remember that not everyone uses Social Media, and post info where the rest of us can get at is as well.
Best,
- Eli Caul KK6ZHZ
From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org on behalf of Fernando Ramirez via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2019 1:17 To: AMSAT -BB Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??
Hi Perry!
AO-92 was kept in U/V mode in order to allow operators more
opportunities
to work N6O/mm from rare grid DM02. The operation will last only one
day.
The decision was announced over the AMSAT Twitter and Facebook
accounts. I
don't recall or can't find if it was posted on the -BB. Might be a good idea for next time.
73 Fernando KF7R
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019, 12:52 AM Perry Yantis via AMSAT-BB < amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
I stayed up late tonight to work AO92 L/V mode only to find that it was still in L/V mode.Then I got on EO88 a few minutes later and was told
that
L/V mode would be on Wednesday this week.It would be nice it this information was posted on the BBS BEFORE the weekend gets here.Also
why the
change anyway????? Perry WB8OTH
py41@att.net sent from my Apple Macbook Pro _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views
of
AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
-- Mark L. Hammond [N8MH]
If you subscribe to the AMSAT news bulletin I believe this switch was mentioned in the upcoming operations section. I didn't notice myself as I already knew, but if not, it would be a good spot to put it.73Rick Tejera (K7TEJ)Saguaro Astronomy ClubWww.saguaroastro.orgThunderbird Astronomy ClubWww.w7tbc.org -------- Original message --------From: Fernando Ramirez via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Date: 9/22/19 15:53 (GMT-07:00) To: "Mark L. Hammond" marklhammond@gmail.com Cc: AMSAT -BB amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode?? Mark, thanks for all your time.Since you mention the command team, perhaps now might be a good chance toapproach other operators that we know have the necessary equipment and askif they would be willing to be part that team. Same goes with the peoplewho manage the social media accounts.Have a great week!73Fernando, KF7ROn Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 3:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.comwrote:> Hi, rest assured it was an oversight from command stations. Sometimes we> get busy with other things (real life) and miss an email. We’ll try to do> better. And by “we” I mean the whole command team. KO4MA and me ;)>> Hopefully users will cooperate on Tuesday night so we can put into L/v at> that time. I’ve been pondering and suggesting a long term swap to> Tuesday/utc Wednesday, like we did for many years as Experimenter’s night.> There are so many grid events and activations on weekends—seems like a good> move to change our schedule so we can have our cake and eat it too!>> 73,> Mark N8MH>> On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 6:26 PM Eli Caul via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:>>> I have been maintaining data resources of this kind for a long time>> (early 90's).>>>> Recently, I've noticed a tendency for folks to allow commercial>> enterprises like FB and Twitter replace the more tried and true methods of>> communication.>>>> In our case, (car clubs) this led to missed opportunities for members>> that choose not to support commercial enterprise or subject themselves to>> the potential privacy and security concerns that these Social Media>> networks expose their 'customers' to.>>>> I love this BB, and I am one of those that has never had a Facebook or>> Twitter account. I hope that the folks in the know remember that not>> everyone uses Social Media, and post info where the rest of us can get at>> is as well.>>>> Best,>>>> - Eli Caul KK6ZHZ>>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________>> From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org on behalf of Fernando>> Ramirez via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org>> Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2019 1:17>> To: AMSAT -BB>> Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??>>>> > Hi Perry!>> >>> > AO-92 was kept in U/V mode in order to allow operators more>> opportunities>> > to work N6O/mm from rare grid DM02. The operation will last only one>> day.>> >>> > The decision was announced over the AMSAT Twitter and Facebook>> accounts. I>> > don't recall or can't find if it was posted on the -BB. Might be a good>> > idea for next time.>> >>> > 73>> > Fernando KF7R>> >>> > On Sun, Sep 22, 2019, 12:52 AM Perry Yantis via AMSAT-BB <>> > amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:>> >>> >> I stayed up late tonight to work AO92 L/V mode only to find that it was>> >> still in L/V mode.Then I got on EO88 a few minutes later and was told>> that>> >> L/V mode would be on Wednesday this week.It would be nice it this>> >> information was posted on the BBS BEFORE the weekend gets here.Also>> why the>> >> change anyway?????>> >> Perry WB8OTH>> >>>> >> py41@att.net>> >> sent from my Apple Macbook Pro>> >> _______________________________________________>> >> Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available>> >> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.>> >> Opinions expressed>> >> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views>> of>> >> AMSAT-NA.>> >> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite>> program!>> >> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb%3E%3E >>>> >>> _______________________________________________>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available>> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.>> Opinions expressed>> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of>> AMSAT-NA.>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!>> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb%3E%3E _______________________________________________>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available>> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.>> Opinions expressed>> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of>> AMSAT-NA.>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!>> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb%3E%3E%3E --> Mark L. Hammond [N8MH]>_______________________________________________Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum availableto all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressedare solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA.Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
(The following is my personal opinion on the subject, and I am not speaking on behalf of any organization with this message)
Hi!
I understand there may be interest in moving the AO-92 L-band period from the current Sunday (UTC time - starting on Saturday evenings in North America). The past "Experimenter's Wednesdays" worked well with AO-10 or AO-13, where the length of passes was measured in hours. With AO-92's passes around 10 minutes each, and factoring in a weekday where those working or in school aren't probably going to work the morning passes, it cuts down on the available time for trying this mode on a given day. For weeknights, the pass times for those working or in school may be too late, so there could be weeks where someone isn't able to work even one AO-92 L/V pass, based on the time of the best available weeknight pass for that location.
This came up last year around JOTA, and AMSAT's decision not to accomodate JOTA by leaving AO-92 in the normal U/V mode. Drew Glasbrenner KO4MA, AMSAT's Vice President of Operations, made the case for not accomodating JOTA at that time:
https://amsat.org/pipermail/amsat-bb/2018-October/069962.html
Since then, AMSAT has accomodated a trip to the Florida Keys and this weekend's trip by AD0DX and N7AGF to DM02 by not switching AO-92 to L/V mode. If these accomodations are more of the "exception" rather than the "rule", I think leaving the current schedule of AO-92 L/V on a weekend would be better. Otherwise, it makes little sense to have this mode available on an AMSAT satellite, and make it difficult for many to use it. We still have a few other satellites for the FM crowd, and many more for those capable of working SSB and CW, in addition to AO-92.
If a reason for considering the shift of the AO-92 L/V schedule is availability of a command station to make the mode change, maybe Fernando KF7R is right - the Operations group needs more command stations. Maybe adding one in the western USA, at least, so there is some geographic diversity in the locations of these stations.
There are new stations trying AO-92 L/V all the time. It's not a huge number, but I hear new call signs regularly. Many have started out with an HT and either a cheap Chinese Yagi or some homebrew antenna, or just bought an IC-9700 with the 1.2 GHz band included with an appropriate antenna. AO-92 gives them an opportunity to do more than just U/V or V/U satellites. I think AMSAT should make an effort to ensure the availability of this mode, where operators will consider obtaining the equipment needed to try it for themselves.
Thanks, and 73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 10:41 PM Mark L. Hammond via AMSAT-BB < amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
Hi, rest assured it was an oversight from command stations. Sometimes we get busy with other things (real life) and miss an email. We’ll try to do better. And by “we” I mean the whole command team. KO4MA and me ;)
Hopefully users will cooperate on Tuesday night so we can put into L/v at that time. I’ve been pondering and suggesting a long term swap to Tuesday/utc Wednesday, like we did for many years as Experimenter’s night. There are so many grid events and activations on weekends—seems like a good move to change our schedule so we can have our cake and eat it too!
73, Mark N8MH
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others. There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run an experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 10:23 PM Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
(The following is my personal opinion on the subject, and I am not speaking on behalf of any organization with this message)
Hi!
I understand there may be interest in moving the AO-92 L-band period from the current Sunday (UTC time - starting on Saturday evenings in North America). The past "Experimenter's Wednesdays" worked well with AO-10 or AO-13, where the length of passes was measured in hours. With AO-92's passes around 10 minutes each, and factoring in a weekday where those working or in school aren't probably going to work the morning passes, it cuts down on the available time for trying this mode on a given day. For weeknights, the pass times for those working or in school may be too late, so there could be weeks where someone isn't able to work even one AO-92 L/V pass, based on the time of the best available weeknight pass for that location.
This came up last year around JOTA, and AMSAT's decision not to accomodate JOTA by leaving AO-92 in the normal U/V mode. Drew Glasbrenner KO4MA, AMSAT's Vice President of Operations, made the case for not accomodating JOTA at that time:
https://amsat.org/pipermail/amsat-bb/2018-October/069962.html
Since then, AMSAT has accomodated a trip to the Florida Keys and this weekend's trip by AD0DX and N7AGF to DM02 by not switching AO-92 to L/V mode. If these accomodations are more of the "exception" rather than the "rule", I think leaving the current schedule of AO-92 L/V on a weekend would be better. Otherwise, it makes little sense to have this mode available on an AMSAT satellite, and make it difficult for many to use it. We still have a few other satellites for the FM crowd, and many more for those capable of working SSB and CW, in addition to AO-92.
If a reason for considering the shift of the AO-92 L/V schedule is availability of a command station to make the mode change, maybe Fernando KF7R is right - the Operations group needs more command stations. Maybe adding one in the western USA, at least, so there is some geographic diversity in the locations of these stations.
There are new stations trying AO-92 L/V all the time. It's not a huge number, but I hear new call signs regularly. Many have started out with an HT and either a cheap Chinese Yagi or some homebrew antenna, or just bought an IC-9700 with the 1.2 GHz band included with an appropriate antenna. AO-92 gives them an opportunity to do more than just U/V or V/U satellites. I think AMSAT should make an effort to ensure the availability of this mode, where operators will consider obtaining the equipment needed to try it for themselves.
Thanks, and 73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 10:41 PM Mark L. Hammond via AMSAT-BB < amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
Hi, rest assured it was an oversight from command stations. Sometimes we get busy with other things (real life) and miss an email. We’ll try to
do
better. And by “we” I mean the whole command team. KO4MA and me ;)
Hopefully users will cooperate on Tuesday night so we can put into L/v at that time. I’ve been pondering and suggesting a long term swap to Tuesday/utc Wednesday, like we did for many years as Experimenter’s
night.
There are so many grid events and activations on weekends—seems like a
good
move to change our schedule so we can have our cake and eat it too!
73, Mark N8MH
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others. There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run an experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
I agree, it may be time for a change to a weekend L/V operation. It seems like I've worked the same 5 people on Tuesday nights..... Variety is good.
Ernie W8EH
On 2/19/2020 4:44 PM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB wrote:
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others. There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run an experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I like the idea of moving the L/V to Tuesday/Wednesday verse the weekend but I have yet to work anyone through AO-92 during the times it cruises over Western Washington in that mode. I am using the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a Comet 16-element Yagi for my L-band uplink and the Elk and my Kenwood TH-F6 for the downlink. Many of the above 30 degree overpasses have had weak receive, I can hear someone but not strong. No one has ever come back to me. As the weather warms up and the rains slow down I will be going out more often to try the L/V mode some more. Thanks for the update and your help
John N7AME
Faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see.
On Wednesday, February 19, 2020, 2:53:15 PM PST, Ernie via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
I agree, it may be time for a change to a weekend L/V operation. It seems like I've worked the same 5 people on Tuesday nights..... Variety is good.
Ernie W8EH
On 2/19/2020 4:44 PM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB wrote:
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others. There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run an experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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It's always the same people anyway. Generally those are the same people who spend all day everyday beside their radio so it doesn't matter what day it's on. Weekends are where new people with their dual band rig decide to give the birds a try typically, keeping U/v gives them more chances to make a first QSO.
Personally, my vote goes to turning on the camera on the weekends so everyone can be frustrated equally with how our volunteer command stations operate.
73, Mike Diehl W8LID/VE6LID
On Wednesday, February 19, 2020, Ernie via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
I agree, it may be time for a change to a weekend L/V operation. It seems like I've worked the same 5 people on Tuesday nights..... Variety is good.
Ernie W8EH
On 2/19/2020 4:44 PM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB wrote:
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others.
There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run an experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I believe Mike is on to something here, this surprise mode change idea sounds interesting. Perhaps our outstanding IT volunteers could code a random number generator script that sends an email to the 2 command station volunteers on a surprise day each week. It would be a requirement of the position that those holding command station authority shall upon receiving this email halt their other activity and command AO92 to L mode on the next available pass. Exceptions of course could be made if any 2 directors object via the social media format of their choosing. If the command station volunteer misses this message then they shall forever be banned from command station authority, and will be forced to wear the "brown baofeng of shame" at every symposium thereafter.
Who's with me?
Dave, KG5CCI
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 6:53 PM Mike Diehl via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
It's always the same people anyway. Generally those are the same people who spend all day everyday beside their radio so it doesn't matter what day it's on. Weekends are where new people with their dual band rig decide to give the birds a try typically, keeping U/v gives them more chances to make a first QSO.
Personally, my vote goes to turning on the camera on the weekends so everyone can be frustrated equally with how our volunteer command stations operate.
73, Mike Diehl W8LID/VE6LID
On Wednesday, February 19, 2020, Ernie via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
I agree, it may be time for a change to a weekend L/V operation. It seems like I've worked the same 5 people on Tuesday nights..... Variety is
good.
Ernie W8EH
On 2/19/2020 4:44 PM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB
wrote:
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond <
marklhammond@gmail.com>
wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and
others.
There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO)
experimenter's
nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event?
Anyhow,
no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run an experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll
switch
AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for
a
few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it
on
Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to
give
it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
Opinions
expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I started playing with a script after you mentioned this using random.seed((26 * 0xFE), 2) and the results look pretty good, I'll keep you posted with what I can cook up.
73, Mike Diehl W8LID/VE6LID
On Wednesday, February 19, 2020, David Swanson dave@druidnetworks.com wrote:
I believe Mike is on to something here, this surprise mode change idea sounds interesting. Perhaps our outstanding IT volunteers could code a random number generator script that sends an email to the 2 command station volunteers on a surprise day each week. It would be a requirement of the position that those holding command station authority shall upon receiving this email halt their other activity and command AO92 to L mode on the next available pass. Exceptions of course could be made if any 2 directors object via the social media format of their choosing. If the command station volunteer misses this message then they shall forever be banned from command station authority, and will be forced to wear the "brown baofeng of shame" at every symposium thereafter.
Who's with me?
Dave, KG5CCI
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 6:53 PM Mike Diehl via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
It's always the same people anyway. Generally those are the same people who spend all day everyday beside their radio so it doesn't matter what day it's on. Weekends are where new people with their dual band rig decide to give the birds a try typically, keeping U/v gives them more chances to make a first QSO.
Personally, my vote goes to turning on the camera on the weekends so everyone can be frustrated equally with how our volunteer command stations operate.
73, Mike Diehl W8LID/VE6LID
On Wednesday, February 19, 2020, Ernie via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
I agree, it may be time for a change to a weekend L/V operation. It
seems
like I've worked the same 5 people on Tuesday nights..... Variety is
good.
Ernie W8EH
On 2/19/2020 4:44 PM, Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB
wrote:
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond <
marklhammond@gmail.com>
wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and
others.
There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO)
experimenter's
nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event?
Anyhow,
no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run
an
experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll
switch
AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way
for a
few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep
it on
Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT
attempt
L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to
give
it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views
of
AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
Opinions
expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I agree with Patrick on moving the AO-91 L/V mode back to the weekends. Last couple of weeks there have been only 3 or 4 people working the mid morning L/V passes...
73 Jeff kb2m
-----Original Message----- From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org On Behalf Of Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 16:44 To: AMSAT amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others. There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts.
What we'll do is run an
experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
_______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I tend to agree that it might give us a bit more variety in those we work.
Today, I did work 8 stations including two new ones to me during the 15:57 UTC pass.
Mike
On 2/19/2020 5:50 PM, Jeff via AMSAT-BB wrote:
I agree with Patrick on moving the AO-91 L/V mode back to the weekends. Last couple of weeks there have been only 3 or 4 people working the mid morning L/V passes...
73 Jeff kb2m
-----Original Message----- From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org On Behalf Of Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 16:44 To: AMSAT amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others. There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts.
What we'll do is run an
experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
As I reported on twitter last night, I was the only operator on the 0602z pass. Nice, high, strong downlink, crickets. And, being a working stiff, that was the only available pass for me.
Totally for going back to the weekend. Thank you Patrick
73, Craig N6RSX
-----Original Message----- From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org On Behalf Of Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 1:44 PM To: AMSAT amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and others. There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts. What we'll do is run an experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
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+1 for returning the AO-92 L/V mode change over the weekend.
While we all appreciate N8MH and the other command stations ops efforts to switch the satellite mode, I still believe the Operations Team should request help from other operators with the necessary equipment, and time, in order to ease the burden of commanding our satellites. In almost 5 years working sats, I have never seen such requests.
73 Fernando, KF7R Arizona
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:58 PM D. Craig Fox via AMSAT-BB < amsat-bb@amsat.org> wrote:
As I reported on twitter last night, I was the only operator on the 0602z pass. Nice, high, strong downlink, crickets. And, being a working stiff, that was the only available pass for me.
Totally for going back to the weekend. Thank you Patrick
73, Craig N6RSX
-----Original Message----- From: AMSAT-BB amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org On Behalf Of Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) via AMSAT-BB Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 1:44 PM To: AMSAT amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] AO92 L/V mode??
Mark,
A few months have passed since this discussion. Based on activity I have seen since that time, it appears that L/V activity on the Tuesday nights and Wednesday mornings dropped, compared to the previous schedule on Saturday nights and Sunday mornings. The only times I saw activity that approached the previous weekend schedule were around Christmas and New Year's Day which fell on Wednesdays.
I think it is appropriate to consider moving the L/V activity back to weekends. There are many with new IC-9700s that might have an easier time trying L/V on a weekend, rather than a late weeknight or a weekday morning, along with others trying all sorts of combinations of radio and antenna for the 1.2 GHz uplink. I'm still enjoying the Alinco DJ-G7T HT with a 10-element Yagi for my L-band uplink, sometimes dropping from 1W "high power" on that band to 300mW.
As for the previous experimenter's activities on AO-51... those ran for a week at a time. After AO-40, I think running those different modes for a week at a time on an LEO satellite like AO-51 was better than simply scheduling one day a week. You and Drew may have had to put AO-51 into a mode like V/S, and then put the satellite back into its normal mode, where AO-92 automatically switches from L/V to U/V after 24 hours. I enjoyed V/S in those days, even with the need to adjust for Doppler on the 2.4 GHz downlink almost constantly for 10 to 15 minutes, along with the cross-mode V/U where we had to transmit in SSB or CW to be heard on the FM downlink. I worked a couple of stations one year during Straight Key Night on AO-51 that way.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK or http://twitter.com/WD9EWK
On Mon, Sep 23, 2019 at 12:37 PM Mark L. Hammond marklhammond@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for pointing out some things for consideration, Patrick and
others.
There is, naturally, a long list of pros/cons for any day we might choose. I seem to have good memories about AO-51 (a LEO) experimenter's nights--and it seems like it was usually a Tuesday night event? Anyhow, no matter when we schedule, we'll have conflicts.
What we'll do is run an
experiment, on Experimenter's night! Effective this week, we'll switch AO-92 L/v operations from Sat/Sun to Tues/Wed, and run it that way for a few months. Then we'll reevaluate to see if it makes sense to keep it on Tues/Wed or switch to another night.
Hopefully this will change it up enough that some who could NOT attempt L-band on our usual schedule due to conflicts, might now be able to give it a shot!
73,
Mark N8MH
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On 2/19/2020 19:13, Fernando Ramirez via AMSAT-BB wrote:
While we all appreciate N8MH and the other command stations ops efforts to switch the satellite mode, I still believe the Operations Team should request help from other operators with the necessary equipment, and time, in order to ease the burden of commanding our satellites. In almost 5 years working sats, I have never seen such requests.
While I can't speak for the enrollment of ground stations in general, I can speak to the command of AO-92.
Since AO-92 has an imaging device that must be and is licensed by NOAA/CRSRA, that puts some important limits on commanding. I am the holder (POC) of the imaging license for Fox-1C and Fox-1D so I get to be sure all of the rules are followed, if nothing else than for a bit of CmYA.
The stations that command AO-92 must be licensed and operated in the U.S., and effect security measures for ensuring their station and any command devices are not accessible to anyone else including your family members. In addition to a quarterly audit and an annual audit that I must undertake, the command stations must be open for NOAA inspection at all reasonable times. There are strict limits on what we can image, which can generally be summed up as "earth only", as any images of other satellites and objects in orbit must be done so with the consent of the owner of the object and absent that, must only be done if they are encrypted per USG approved standards. That last piece rules out taking any such images and sending the data over amateur radio, just as we have an exemption from encrypting earth images because we are amateur radio - but also limited to earth images only because we can't encrypt any ARSO objects. Command stations must be registered with and approve by NOAA/CRSRA, and because of the nature of the steps for achieving that I would stress the permanence of their participation to our VP Ops, i.e. being selective of stations who can provide reliable command service for at least one year and preferably, for the life of the satellite(s). There are strict limits on resolution of the images, and the imagers are capable of more than their licensed resolution therefore it is important to ensure images are only captured and downlinked in the licensed format.
The command stations who are selected by AMSAT for imaging satellite command privileges must be able to answer to me whether directly or via VP Operations when queries or anomalies are brought to me by NOAA/CRSRA as well as for audits.
This is not the entire list although it certainly covers the most important items that come into play when selecting command stations. As the responsible party for our imaging license I have determined that given the amount of work involved, the sensitivity of the command information, imaging, imaging control, and downlinked images, the availability and capability to command AO-92, and the trust that must be placed in an imaging capable command station, for the time being, only three AMSAT command stations be allowed to command AO-92.
If access by additional command stations is shown to be a requirement for the operation of AO-92, during consideration and vetting of the candidate station by VP Operations I would provide input and make a recommendation whether the station is qualified in my opinion, to properly satisfy our NOAA/CRSRA imaging license. As of this time, I have seen nothing brought forth in debates on amsat-bb or other media (and of course, I do not nor do I intend to look at them all) that shows any sincere and responsible desire to function as a command station for an imaging satellite, other than personal desires for days of operation for Downshifter (Mode L, or L band operation). I also would not expect that any such requests would be made in the public forum given the sensitivity of the operation, in other words in this case given by Fernando, you will likely never see any discussion of at least the imaging command stations here or anywhere other than an announcement of a new command station.
Like EAR, like orbital debris, like the NDAs that we are part of in getting satellites launched, and no, don't ask to see our license because like the laws and agreements covering NOAA/CRSRA imaging licenses, you won't see any of that here. That is the nature of the game, these days. I play by NOAA (in this case, or any other of the above) rules and we all work hard within those rules to put satellites into orbit. I know everybody wants to know everything, but put simply, you can't. It's not personal, it's business. And while ham radio (satellites) is a hobby, AMSAT and the in-space operation and control of our satellites are strictly business.
I hope this provides some detail to expand on what happens, to show that rather than the solution often bandied about when things don't seem to happen the way someone wants it to as "because we're being mean", is not true. If I were mean, I wouldn't even take time to try to help you understand!
And now to be mean just to keep -bb in its groove, I will likely not respond to any questions about this here because of the reasons above, and because there are still many things to do to keep getting our next three satellites on track to in-orbit. Perhaps I can expand in an AMSAT Journal piece, if there is truly enough interest (and I can do so without violating our license)!
73
Jerry Buxton, NØJY
From: Eli Caul wrote:
I love this BB, and I am one of those that has never had a Facebook or Twitter account. I hope that the folks in the know remember that not everyone uses Social Media, and post info where the rest of us can get at is as well.
This is a valid point.
At the same time, there are often compromise positions that can be taken. For example, Twitter can entirely be used to follow a team's updates simply by pointing your web browser to the URL for that team's account. You don't have to have a Twitter account, or logon, or anything. Instant status updates are literally what Twitter is designed for.
The problem with email lists is that email, despite its reputation today (thanks to the hard work of hundreds of thousands of engineers and architects), is *NOT GUARANTEED* to be instantaneous in delivery -- or, even, to guarantee delivery at all. I can't tell you how many messages from this very list I've received with 1-2 days of delay or more, or find them squirreled away in Junk Mail for whatever reason. I'm a professional email architect, I practically live on my computer, and there's nothing I can do about these delays and reroutes.
Some teams want the overhead of using multiple communication methods. Some don't. It's a choice of what is the most bang for the buck.
Every choice we make has consequences. Sometimes it is not possible to have it all.
-- Devin L. Ganger (WA7DLG) email: devin@thecabal.org web: Devin on Earth cell: +1 425.239.2575
As somebody who has waited up until 3am many times, standing out in my yard holding an arrow antenna, hoping that AO-7 would be active in mode B and not have been flipped to mode A by a qro station, only to be disappointed, or hoped that HF propagation would go my way, so I could work some particular DX... I don’t really understand so many people having the attitude that these mode changes and stuff are to be treated like an airline or train schedule.
This is a hobby. It’s for fun. Volunteers put in time and effort to enable us to play with sats in our free time. These guys make a reasonable effort to advise everybody of mode changes, in consistent, publicly accessible ways. If you’re capable of operating a complex multi band/mode sat station with automated rotors, then you probably also have the technical skills to check twitter.com/amsat (no account needed!) along with your BB email...
- Matthew nj4y
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 22, 2019, at 23:48, Devin L. Ganger via AMSAT-BB amsat-bb@amsat.org wrote:
From: Eli Caul wrote:
I love this BB, and I am one of those that has never had a Facebook or Twitter account. I hope that the folks in the know remember that not everyone uses Social Media, and post info where the rest of us can get at is as well.
This is a valid point.
At the same time, there are often compromise positions that can be taken. For example, Twitter can entirely be used to follow a team's updates simply by pointing your web browser to the URL for that team's account. You don't have to have a Twitter account, or logon, or anything. Instant status updates are literally what Twitter is designed for.
The problem with email lists is that email, despite its reputation today (thanks to the hard work of hundreds of thousands of engineers and architects), is *NOT GUARANTEED* to be instantaneous in delivery -- or, even, to guarantee delivery at all. I can't tell you how many messages from this very list I've received with 1-2 days of delay or more, or find them squirreled away in Junk Mail for whatever reason. I'm a professional email architect, I practically live on my computer, and there's nothing I can do about these delays and reroutes.
Some teams want the overhead of using multiple communication methods. Some don't. It's a choice of what is the most bang for the buck.
Every choice we make has consequences. Sometimes it is not possible to have it all.
-- Devin L. Ganger (WA7DLG) email: devin@thecabal.org web: Devin on Earth cell: +1 425.239.2575 _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
participants (15)
-
D. Craig Fox -
David Swanson -
Devin L. Ganger -
Eli Caul -
Ernie -
Fernando Ramirez -
Jeff -
Jerry Buxton -
johnv＠frontier.com -
Mark L. Hammond -
Matthew Stevens -
Mike Diehl -
Mike Seguin -
Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) -
saguaroastro