Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ
Michael,
The idea is to get people hooked on satellite operating and then have them "graduate" to more challenging aspects of satellite operating.
AMSAT is, of course, working on projects that be more of a technical challenge than FM satellites, like Fox-1E with a linear transponder and the geosynchronous P4B project.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Michael [email protected] wrote:
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Funny how a linear bird is a technical challenge, wow, as a novice in 1975 I listened to Oscar 6 & 7 all the time. and once up graded used them also all the time. Sad to think that 1970's technology is high tech to anyone. Joe WB9SBD Sig The Original Rolling Ball Clock Idle Tyme Idle-Tyme.com http://www.idle-tyme.com On 7/4/2015 12:10 PM, Paul Stoetzer wrote:
Michael,
The idea is to get people hooked on satellite operating and then have them "graduate" to more challenging aspects of satellite operating.
AMSAT is, of course, working on projects that be more of a technical challenge than FM satellites, like Fox-1E with a linear transponder and the geosynchronous P4B project.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Michael [email protected] wrote:
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Joe - Before FM birds came into being, Mode A was the easysat mode, although that term was not used. The 10M downlink doppler was easy to deal with and the 144 MHz uplink not much harder. The RS birds in particular had huge signals on the downlink, sensitive receivers, consistent 20+ minute passes, and could be heard with the gear most hams had; an HF transceiver. To get started, many hams used their 2M rig as a CW rig by keying the PTT. It sounded pretty chirpy, but those guys made a lot of contacts and generally graduated to a 2M CW or SSB rig.
The problem in those days was getting the Mode A easysat guys to move up to Mode B or Mode J, with better performance. It is a problem very similar to what we have today of getting the FM easysat guys to move up to the linear birds.
I have no problem with the entry level to satellite communication being easy. I do have problems when the entry level guys don’t move up, either because they are satisfied with the status quo, don’t get encouragement from experienced ops, or because the resources are not there.
I don’t mean to denigrate Steve’s article, but rather to respond to Cliff’s comments and its implications. - Duffey KK6MC
On Jul 4, 2015, at 11:19 AM, Joe [email protected] wrote:
Funny how a linear bird is a technical challenge, wow, as a novice in 1975 I listened to Oscar 6 & 7 all the time. and once up graded used them also all the time. Sad to think that 1970's technology is high tech to anyone. Joe WB9SBD Sig The Original Rolling Ball Clock Idle Tyme Idle-Tyme.com http://www.idle-tyme.com On 7/4/2015 12:10 PM, Paul Stoetzer wrote:
Michael,
The idea is to get people hooked on satellite operating and then have them "graduate" to more challenging aspects of satellite operating.
AMSAT is, of course, working on projects that be more of a technical challenge than FM satellites, like Fox-1E with a linear transponder and the geosynchronous P4B project.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Michael [email protected] wrote:
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Well, you are partially right. With OSCAR 6 and 7 and their strong ten meter downlinks, it was just a matter of adding two meter transmit capability to an HF station. Now it does take a little more work to receive and transmit at VHF and UHF with SSB or CW and the prevalence of man-made noise on VHF and UHF these days generally requires a beam.
I am quite certain that many of the people that worked OSCARs, 6, 7, 8, and the RS birds never graduated from Mode A. Just like many of the FM satellite users never graduate from FM.
People tend to think it's more difficult than it is. I've made over 2,000 linear transponder contacts with nothing more than two Yaesu FT-817s (for a few hundred of those I used an Icom IC-R10 receiver) and an Arrow antenna handheld.
The radios for operating via a linear transponder are widely available and inexpensive. A Yaesu FT-100, FT-817, FT-857, FT-897, FT-991 or an Icom IC-706MkII(g), Icom IC-7000, or any of those plus a FUNcube dongle and computer to receive the downlink are all the radio you need and an Arrow or Elk antenna will get you going.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 1:19 PM, Joe [email protected] wrote:
Funny how a linear bird is a technical challenge, wow, as a novice in 1975 I listened to Oscar 6 & 7 all the time. and once up graded used them also all the time. Sad to think that 1970's technology is high tech to anyone. Joe WB9SBD Sig The Original Rolling Ball Clock Idle Tyme Idle-Tyme.com http://www.idle-tyme.com
On 7/4/2015 12:10 PM, Paul Stoetzer wrote:
Michael,
The idea is to get people hooked on satellite operating and then have them "graduate" to more challenging aspects of satellite operating.
AMSAT is, of course, working on projects that be more of a technical challenge than FM satellites, like Fox-1E with a linear transponder and the geosynchronous P4B project.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Michael [email protected] wrote:
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Why don't they have mode "A" anymore? even the single channel FM could be mode a true? Sig The Original Rolling Ball Clock Idle Tyme Idle-Tyme.com http://www.idle-tyme.com On 7/4/2015 12:48 PM, Paul Stoetzer wrote:
Well, you are partially right. With OSCAR 6 and 7 and their strong ten meter downlinks, it was just a matter of adding two meter transmit capability to an HF station. Now it does take a little more work to receive and transmit at VHF and UHF with SSB or CW and the prevalence of man-made noise on VHF and UHF these days generally requires a beam.
I am quite certain that many of the people that worked OSCARs, 6, 7, 8, and the RS birds never graduated from Mode A. Just like many of the FM satellite users never graduate from FM.
People tend to think it's more difficult than it is. I've made over 2,000 linear transponder contacts with nothing more than two Yaesu FT-817s (for a few hundred of those I used an Icom IC-R10 receiver) and an Arrow antenna handheld.
The radios for operating via a linear transponder are widely available and inexpensive. A Yaesu FT-100, FT-817, FT-857, FT-897, FT-991 or an Icom IC-706MkII(g), Icom IC-7000, or any of those plus a FUNcube dongle and computer to receive the downlink are all the radio you need and an Arrow or Elk antenna will get you going.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 1:19 PM, Joe [email protected] wrote:
Funny how a linear bird is a technical challenge, wow, as a novice in 1975 I listened to Oscar 6 & 7 all the time. and once up graded used them also all the time. Sad to think that 1970's technology is high tech to anyone. Joe WB9SBD Sig The Original Rolling Ball Clock Idle Tyme Idle-Tyme.com http://www.idle-tyme.com
On 7/4/2015 12:10 PM, Paul Stoetzer wrote:
Michael,
The idea is to get people hooked on satellite operating and then have them "graduate" to more challenging aspects of satellite operating.
AMSAT is, of course, working on projects that be more of a technical challenge than FM satellites, like Fox-1E with a linear transponder and the geosynchronous P4B project.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Michael [email protected] wrote:
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
So, we should make them only available to the Amateur Radio elite who can afford computer tracked rotors with separate yagis and all-mode full duplex U/V radios? Keep out the riff-raff.
Steve AI9IN Riff-raff@EM79
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve Kristoff [email protected]
in the voice of Jack Benny, "well I'll be" I'm a elitist now. My Elmer when I got into this hobby (1967) said "this is not a poor man's hobby. Still holds true today as far as I know. Got to pay to play.
22 elements on VHF crossed 44 on UHF on UHF crossed and the S band dish is still up from the days of AO 40.
John
On 7/4/2015 12:15 PM, Steve Kristoff wrote:
So, we should make them only available to the Amateur Radio elite who can afford computer tracked rotors with separate yagis and all-mode full duplex U/V radios? Keep out the riff-raff.
You're missing the point, Steve.
This is supposed to be an *educational* activity, not "Gee Look how *EASY* it is".
If you can afford one Baofeng HT, then you can afford TWO so you can run full duplex.
The FM satellites are a zoo 90% of the time. People just don't want to admit it......
Jim KQ6EA
On 07/04/2015 05:15 PM, Steve Kristoff wrote:
So, we should make them only available to the Amateur Radio elite who can afford computer tracked rotors with separate yagis and all-mode full duplex U/V radios? Keep out the riff-raff.
Steve AI9IN Riff-raff@EM79
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve Kristoff [email protected]
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
I have no idea if you're a teacher or not, but generally speaking, if you want to help someone learn something, you start with the easy stuff, then help them work their way up. Also, this is a hobby. Some folks may simply find it fun to work an FM satellite once in a while and sweat the fancy stuff.
Steve AI9IN P.S. Two Baofengs won't get you full-duplex because the one you use for the receiver desensitizes when you transmit with the other one.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Jerzycke" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2015 2:28 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
You're missing the point, Steve.
This is supposed to be an *educational* activity, not "Gee Look how *EASY* it is".
If you can afford one Baofeng HT, then you can afford TWO so you can run full duplex.
The FM satellites are a zoo 90% of the time. People just don't want to admit it......
Jim KQ6EA
On 07/04/2015 05:15 PM, Steve Kristoff wrote:
So, we should make them only available to the Amateur Radio elite who can afford computer tracked rotors with separate yagis and all-mode full duplex U/V radios? Keep out the riff-raff.
Steve AI9IN Riff-raff@EM79
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve Kristoff [email protected]
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve Kristoff [email protected]
Not necessarily. A simple low pass filter or diplexer on the output of the transmit radio should eliminate enough of the third harmonic to prevent desense.
Since it's a third harmonic issue, this should not be a problem on EO-80 or the Fox-1 satellites.
73,
Paul, N8HM
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 2:45 PM, Steve Kristoff [email protected] wrote:
I have no idea if you're a teacher or not, but generally speaking, if you want to help someone learn something, you start with the easy stuff, then help them work their way up. Also, this is a hobby. Some folks may simply find it fun to work an FM satellite once in a while and sweat the fancy stuff.
Steve AI9IN P.S. Two Baofengs won't get you full-duplex because the one you use for the receiver desensitizes when you transmit with the other one.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Jerzycke" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2015 2:28 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
You're missing the point, Steve.
This is supposed to be an *educational* activity, not "Gee Look how *EASY* it is".
If you can afford one Baofeng HT, then you can afford TWO so you can run full duplex.
The FM satellites are a zoo 90% of the time. People just don't want to admit it......
Jim KQ6EA
On 07/04/2015 05:15 PM, Steve Kristoff wrote:
So, we should make them only available to the Amateur Radio elite who can afford computer tracked rotors with separate yagis and all-mode full duplex U/V radios? Keep out the riff-raff.
Steve AI9IN Riff-raff@EM79
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve Kristoff [email protected]
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve Kristoff [email protected]
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve,
Not entirely correct. Unfortunately, the quality control on the Baofeng assembly line is now what it should be. No two radios of the same Baofeng model will perform the same, every time. It is possible to use two UV-5Rs, two UV-82s, or a combination of UV-5R and UV-82 to work satellites. I've done this. I don't normally use this option, but did it so I could "walk the walk" when I say that it is possible to use two of these inexpensive radios - including at a hamfest demonstration I gave last year in southern Arizona:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cLx9h-vNRA
I used a UV-82 as the transmit radio, since it has a PTT that can key each VFO individually. The speaker-mic I use with the UV-82 also has separate PTT buttons. I put 145.850 MHz in both VFOs, and set the appropriate PL tones to activate the satellite (74.4 Hz) and to talk through the satellite (67.0 Hz) in each VFO. No need to change frequencies/memories on the transmit radio with this setup. I used a UV-5R as the receive radio, set to tune in 2.5 Hz
I may have an advantage in working SO-50 with two of these HTs, since I use an Elk log periodic instead of an Arrow Yagi or equivalent homebrew dual-band Yagi. I have to use a diplexer to connect two radios to the single feedpoint on the Elk, so the diplexer is also serving as a bandpass filter.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK
P.S. Two Baofengs won't get you full-duplex because the one you use for the receiver desensitizes when you transmit with the other one.
For a semi-clueless, riff-raff newbie, this has been an enlightening discussion. I will endeavor to go full-duplex, once I figure out how to tell my xyl I need another radio. ;-)
73,
--Bill, KG5FQX
Bill,
About the only thing I know for sure after working sats for a very long time is that full-duplex is by far the best way to go.
"once I figure out how to tell my xyl I need another radio"
Wait till the XYL wants something like an expensive trip or new furniture and then throw the radio into the mix. The better option is to buy the radio on the down low and then in the unlikely event that she discovers it just try to look pathetic and sort of shrug and mumble some technical nonsense.
73 tom... W9KE (also a scuba diver back in the day)
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 2:09 PM, Bill Dillon [email protected] wrote:
For a semi-clueless, riff-raff newbie, this has been an enlightening discussion. I will endeavor to go full-duplex, once I figure out how to tell my xyl I need another radio. ;-)
73,
--Bill, KG5FQX _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Greeting Satellite friends and a happy 4th -From the moment I worked either it was RS 12 or 13 with 15M up and 10M down with a Swan 350 and Drake R4A , over twenty years ago. I knew the die was cast and all brakes were off. The XYL "situation" not withstanding. It took time but the "onward" trajectory was constatant-VHF/UHF Icom twins, manual everything. Now with a IC-910, 14 el CP on 2M, 40 el CP on 70cm. Yaesu G5500 az/el Everything computer controled. L and S band complete systems in moth balls. I still dig for the challenge that started everything. Being of the digitally challenged group it can be PITA. I consider my crowning achievement a fully functional capability system with AO-40 (sobsob). Should in the future we have the wherewithal (money) to get another or similar AO-10/13/40 up there. They will pour of out of the woodwork, (build it and they will come). Unfortunately we need the funds before the people. My potential lottery winnings are earmarked for that. Untill then my friends we must dig deep and pay what we can. Currently when time permits I will work everything up there, still learning the digital stuff (not easy). Like my friend Frank (K4FEG) says, "work-em till the antennas vaporize". The big party line we have with each other on the satellites is enjoyable and new ops are a special treat. We all approach this endeavor and some stop where they do for whatever reason. For the "brakes are off" people it's can be and is a hell of a fun ride. 73 Bob W7LRD Seattle-CN87
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dillon" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 12:09:57 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
For a semi-clueless, riff-raff newbie, this has been an enlightening discussion. I will endeavor to go full-duplex, once I figure out how to tell my xyl I need another radio. ;-)
73,
--Bill, KG5FQX _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Bob, You jogged some good memories here. I remember working the RS Birdsback in the '70's on Mode A with Inverted Vee's on 10 & 2M and trackingwith a TRS-80 and a freeware program. The Band was often loaded withusers on CW & SSB!! Mode K was a blast using 10M up and 15M down.The Ruskies made some excellent satellites!!!! Sorry that they're gone. 73, Bob K8BL From: Bob- W7LRD [email protected] To: Bill Dillon [email protected] Cc: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 4:28 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Greeting Satellite friends and a happy 4th -From the moment I worked either it was RS 12 or 13 with 15M up and 10M down with a Swan 350 and Drake R4A , over twenty years ago. I knew the die was cast and all brakes were off. The XYL "situation" not withstanding. It took time but the "onward" trajectory was constatant-VHF/UHF Icom twins, manual everything. Now with a IC-910, 14 el CP on 2M, 40 el CP on 70cm. Yaesu G5500 az/el Everything computer controled. L and S band complete systems in moth balls. I still dig for the challenge that started everything. Being of the digitally challenged group it can be PITA. I consider my crowning achievement a fully functional capability system with AO-40 (sobsob). Should in the future we have the wherewithal (money) to get another or similar AO-10/13/40 up there. They will pour of out of the woodwork, (build it and they will come). Unfortunately we need the funds before the people. My potential lottery winnings are earmarked for that. Untill then my friends we must dig deep and pay w hat we can. Currently when time permits I will work everything up there, still learning the digital stuff (not easy). Like my friend Frank (K4FEG) says, "work-em till the antennas vaporize". The big party line we have with each other on the satellites is enjoyable and new ops are a special treat. We all approach this endeavor and some stop where they do for whatever reason. For the "brakes are off" people it's can be and is a hell of a fun ride. 73 Bob W7LRD Seattle-CN87
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dillon" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 12:09:57 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
For a semi-clueless, riff-raff newbie, this has been an enlightening discussion. I will endeavor to go full-duplex, once I figure out how to tell my xyl I need another radio. ;-)
73,
--Bill, KG5FQX _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Hi again!
A correction.... the UV-5R I used in the YouTube video I referenced earlier was set to tune in 2.5 kHz steps, not 2.5 Hz steps.
The Baofeng radios, like those from the other Chinese brands, tend to have sharper front-ends than the Icom/Yaesu/Kenwood amateur HTs. There will be moments where the UV-5R (and other Chinese-made radios) won't hear the SO-50 downlink, if you are tuning these radios in 5 kHz steps.
When the time comes that we have Fox-1 FM satellites and EO-80, I don't think it will be necessary to tune the 70cm uplinks in 2.5 kHz steps. The 5 kHz steps would probably work fine, and this is something I'll try as these satellites become available for us to use.
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ Twitter: @WD9EWK
Not at all, My first and only antenna system consisted of a homebrew tracking box with point to point wiring and an old pair of Orbit 360 TV rotators topped with homebrew yagis with a modest amount of elements. I'm trying to ressurect it now. My rig was to only semi expensive thing I had. If you're trying to make me out to be some snob because I don't think we used the right approach and should have challenged people's technical prowess, then you're barking up the wrong tree. Michael, W4HIJ On 7/4/2015 1:15 PM, Steve Kristoff wrote:
So, we should make them only available to the Amateur Radio elite who can afford computer tracked rotors with separate yagis and all-mode full duplex U/V radios? Keep out the riff-raff.
Steve AI9IN Riff-raff@EM79
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael" [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Steve Kristoff [email protected]
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Yuri, UT1FG/MM has worked many stations half-duplex and givenout a ton of rare grids. Maybe he should be educated about how "dumb"his operating technique is? ? ? ? ? Bob K8BL From: Michael [email protected] To: "[email protected]" [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Yuri is an experienced operator, not somebody with an HT and an Arrow/Elk standing in their backyard waving the antenna around and saying "Helllllooooooo" into the radio for the entire pass.
Jim KQ6EA
On 07/04/2015 06:34 PM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
Yuri, UT1FG/MM has worked many stations half-duplex and givenout a ton of rare grids. Maybe he should be educated about how "dumb"his operating technique is? ? ? ? ? Bob K8BL From: Michael [email protected] To: "[email protected]" [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Yep, just goes to show you how a highly skilled operatorlike Yuri can have great success using half-duplex whennecessary. Bob K8BL (AMSAT #6593) From: Jim Jerzycke [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 2:34 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Yuri is an experienced operator, not somebody with an HT and an Arrow/Elk standing in their backyard waving the antenna around and saying "Helllllooooooo" into the radio for the entire pass.
Jim KQ6EA
On 07/04/2015 06:34 PM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
Yuri, UT1FG/MM has worked many stations half-duplex and givenout a ton of rare grids. Maybe he should be educated about how "dumb"his operating technique is? ? ? ? ? Bob K8BL From: Michael [email protected] To: "[email protected]" [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al.... Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
The key phrase being "when necessary" which should be never or almost never. I'm sorry so many of you got offended at my view of the hobby but this duplex issue should have been put to bed long ago. BTW, my "snob elitist" station I'm putting back together will consist of my FT-991 which is my main rig and a Funcube Dongle Pro. Antennas will be WA5VJB "cheap yagis". I'm also working with someone to have gerbers made of my rotor control system schematic and if that doesn't work, I'll be riding the control of a TV rotator manually. Hardly some high dollar approach meant to shut others out but a challenge to get all together and working in concert. 73, Michael, W4HIJ On 7/4/2015 10:19 PM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
Yep, just goes to show you how a highly skilled operatorlike Yuri can have great success using half-duplex whennecessary. Bob K8BL (AMSAT #6593) From: Jim Jerzycke [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 2:34 PM Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Yuri is an experienced operator, not somebody with an HT and an Arrow/Elk standing in their backyard waving the antenna around and saying "Helllllooooooo" into the radio for the entire pass.
Jim KQ6EA
On 07/04/2015 06:34 PM, R.T.Liddy wrote:
Yuri, UT1FG/MM has worked many stations half-duplex and givenout a ton of rare grids. Maybe he should be educated about how "dumb"his operating technique is? ? ? ? ? Bob K8BL From: Michael [email protected] To: "[email protected]" [email protected] Sent: Saturday, July 4, 2015 1:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Fox, "Easy Sats"....et al....
Once again I feel the need to say that we have gone in the wrong direction by trying to convince everyone how easy a "sat" is to work with a handheld antenna. I got into satellite communication because of the technical challenge involved, not by how "easy it was". This whole half or full duplex issue is a symptom of "dumbing down" There should never be any question on it. Full duplex should ALWAYS be used. 73, Michael, W4HIJ _______________________________________________
_______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
participants (12)
-
Bill Dillon -
Bob- W7LRD -
James Duffey -
Jim Jerzycke -
Joe -
John Becker -
Michael -
Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) -
Paul Stoetzer -
R.T.Liddy -
Steve Kristoff -
Thomas Doyle