Re: The need for telemetry data -or what happened to FO-29-
...One key component of failure analysis is the availability of data, especially telemetry.
My question is, can the satellite user community at large come up with a system that allows the routine capturing of satellite telemetry? Is there a role that AMSAT can play? What would it take?
All of the APRS satellites (PCSAT-1, PCSAT2, ANDE and RAFT) use AX.25 and beacon their telemetry around the world. Any telemetry packets, heard by any station that is on the internet, feeds the packets live into the global APRS internet. Not only does this make it available to anyone at any time, but the data is also archived and is available in graphical form over any date period.
For example, Simple URL's can be constructed to access and plot any of the telemetry parameters. See this WEB page:
http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/andeTemps.html
And look at the source code. You will see that each plot is simply a URL constructed to access the correct period of data, and to select the range of values and the labels. This way, this data can be incorporated into any application. Thanks to the work fof K4HG, Steve Dimese and the FINDU system.
This is all hands-off, fully automated, and routine. Not only does it work for the satellites, but it can also plot all of this same data for ANY KPC-3+ TNC that is sending periodic telemetry packets anywhere in the world on any APRS frequency. For example, this simple URL will plot the telemetry for ANY KPC-3+ TNC on the air. This one is my local digipeater:
http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/tele2.cgi?call=wb4apr-1&last=240
Just change the ULR callsign to your TNC's callsign (if it is tramnsmitting its 5 channel telemetry beacons on any APRS frequency) and you will see it show up here. This is a fantastic system for quick-and-dirty experiments, since the global collection and plotting is already done.
Bob, WB4APR
Thanks Bob.
Point well made for the PCsats.
Question: Are you proposing that all future satellites should send telemetry on the APRS frequency to make this system work?
Stefan
From: "Robert Bruninga" bruninga@usna.edu Reply-To: bruninga@usna.edu To: "'Stefan Wagener'" stefan_wagener@hotmail.com, amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] The need for telemetry data -or what happened to FO-29- Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 11:03:55 -0400
...One key component of failure analysis is the availability of data, especially telemetry.
My question is, can the satellite user community at large come up with a system that allows the routine capturing of satellite telemetry? Is there a role that AMSAT can play? What would it take?
All of the APRS satellites (PCSAT-1, PCSAT2, ANDE and RAFT) use AX.25 and beacon their telemetry around the world. Any telemetry packets, heard by any station that is on the internet, feeds the packets live into the global APRS internet. Not only does this make it available to anyone at any time, but the data is also archived and is available in graphical form over any date period.
For example, Simple URL's can be constructed to access and plot any of the telemetry parameters. See this WEB page:
http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/andeTemps.html
And look at the source code. You will see that each plot is simply a URL constructed to access the correct period of data, and to select the range of values and the labels. This way, this data can be incorporated into any application. Thanks to the work fof K4HG, Steve Dimese and the FINDU system.
This is all hands-off, fully automated, and routine. Not only does it work for the satellites, but it can also plot all of this same data for ANY KPC-3+ TNC that is sending periodic telemetry packets anywhere in the world on any APRS frequency. For example, this simple URL will plot the telemetry for ANY KPC-3+ TNC on the air. This one is my local digipeater:
http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/tele2.cgi?call=wb4apr-1&last=240
Just change the ULR callsign to your TNC's callsign (if it is tramnsmitting its 5 channel telemetry beacons on any APRS frequency) and you will see it show up here. This is a fantastic system for quick-and-dirty experiments, since the global collection and plotting is already done.
Bob, WB4APR
Stefan,
This system is working for any unproto packet satellite. I'am feeding all my received packets to the aprs2 network. This way anyone connected can see the received telemetry. See the libertad cubesat: http://www.db0anf.de/hamweb/aprsdb/showdata.php?cfrom=5k3l
It would be nice when more radio amateur would do this
73 Rob PE1ITR.
Stefan Wagener schreef:
Thanks Bob.
Point well made for the PCsats.
Question: Are you proposing that all future satellites should send telemetry on the APRS frequency to make this system work?
Stefan
From: "Robert Bruninga" bruninga@usna.edu Reply-To: bruninga@usna.edu To: "'Stefan Wagener'" stefan_wagener@hotmail.com, amsat-bb@amsat.org Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] The need for telemetry data -or what happened to FO-29- Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 11:03:55 -0400
...One key component of failure analysis is the availability of data, especially telemetry.
My question is, can the satellite user community at large come up with a system that allows the routine capturing of satellite telemetry? Is there a role that AMSAT can play? What would it take?
All of the APRS satellites (PCSAT-1, PCSAT2, ANDE and RAFT) use AX.25 and beacon their telemetry around the world. Any telemetry packets, heard by any station that is on the internet, feeds the packets live into the global APRS internet. Not only does this make it available to anyone at any time, but the data is also archived and is available in graphical form over any date period.
For example, Simple URL's can be constructed to access and plot any of the telemetry parameters. See this WEB page:
http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/andeTemps.html
And look at the source code. You will see that each plot is simply a URL constructed to access the correct period of data, and to select the range of values and the labels. This way, this data can be incorporated into any application. Thanks to the work fof K4HG, Steve Dimese and the FINDU system.
This is all hands-off, fully automated, and routine. Not only does it work for the satellites, but it can also plot all of this same data for ANY KPC-3+ TNC that is sending periodic telemetry packets anywhere in the world on any APRS frequency. For example, this simple URL will plot the telemetry for ANY KPC-3+ TNC on the air. This one is my local digipeater:
http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/tele2.cgi?call=wb4apr-1&last=240
Just change the ULR callsign to your TNC's callsign (if it is tramnsmitting its 5 channel telemetry beacons on any APRS frequency) and you will see it show up here. This is a fantastic system for quick-and-dirty experiments, since the global collection and plotting is already done.
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
73 Rob PE1ITR http://www.pe1itr.com
Gentlemans,
all these about TLM-capturing are good & rights, and yes, it's a reality for the birds like PACSAT, ANDE etc. as they already have AX.25.
But, at my opinion, the Analogue-Birds is other story. They have a different category of users. They are interesting mainly for QSOs, firstly. So, it's definitely a "bore job" for this kind of peoples to capture the TLM, when at the same time they can do "exciting" QSOs through the Satellite.
On the other hand a "stand-alone" TLM-capturing-system needs a second RX, fully-controlled by software for auto Doppler-correction and Tracking. That is no so easy for an amateur operator, which is firstly aimed to make QSOs through analogue birds. Definitely he needs much more complicate and expensive Shack, in order to be able to cover this requirements.
Another point of view is that, for example: FO-29 was in good-shape for about 10 years. Well, can you tell me how many they will spend money for a second receiver + necessary equipments for TLM-capturing, if they know that the captured-files are useful just for 1-2 times per 10 years, under like FO-29's malfunction?
Closing, I would like to say again, I'm not negative to this idea. Just I'm a little-bit skeptic about the possibilities right-now on Analogue-Birds. May be in the far future is easier and much more effective due to the new, better & more flexible equipments (ie SDR), but for now and the short future, I wondering.
Have a nice month
73, Mak SV1BSX
--- Rob Hardenberg rob@itr-datanet.com wrote:
Stefan,
This system is working for any unproto packet satellite. I'am feeding all my received packets to the aprs2 network. This way anyone connected can see the received telemetry. See the libertad cubesat:
http://www.db0anf.de/hamweb/aprsdb/showdata.php?cfrom=5k3l
It would be nice when more radio amateur would do this
73 Rob PE1ITR.
Stefan Wagener schreef:
Thanks Bob.
Point well made for the PCsats.
Question: Are you proposing that all future
satellites should send telemetry
on the APRS frequency to make this system work?
Stefan
From: "Robert Bruninga" bruninga@usna.edu Reply-To: bruninga@usna.edu To: "'Stefan Wagener'"
stefan_wagener@hotmail.com, amsat-bb@amsat.org
Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] The need for telemetry
data -or what happened to
FO-29- Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 11:03:55 -0400
...One key component of failure analysis is the availability of data, especially telemetry.
My question is, can the satellite user
community at
large come up with a system that allows the
routine
capturing of satellite telemetry? Is there a role that AMSAT can play? What would it take?
All of the APRS satellites (PCSAT-1, PCSAT2, ANDE
and RAFT) use
AX.25 and beacon their telemetry around the world.
Any
telemetry packets, heard by any station that is on
the internet,
feeds the packets live into the global APRS
internet. Not only
does this make it available to anyone at any time,
but the data
is also archived and is available in graphical
form over any
date period.
For example, Simple URL's can be constructed to
access and plot
any of the telemetry parameters. See this WEB
page:
http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/andeTemps.html
And look at the source code. You will see that
each plot is
simply a URL constructed to access the correct period of
data, and to
select the range of values and the labels. This
way, this data
can be incorporated into any application. Thanks
to the work fof
K4HG, Steve Dimese and the FINDU system.
This is all hands-off, fully automated, and
routine. Not only
does it work for the satellites, but it can also
plot all of
this same data for ANY KPC-3+ TNC that is sending
periodic
telemetry packets anywhere in the world on any
APRS frequency.
For example, this simple URL will plot the
telemetry for ANY
KPC-3+ TNC on the air. This one is my local
digipeater:
http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/tele2.cgi?call=wb4apr-1&last=240
Just change the ULR callsign to your TNC's
callsign (if it is
tramnsmitting its 5 channel telemetry beacons on
any APRS
frequency) and you will see it show up here. This
is a
fantastic system for quick-and-dirty experiments,
since the
global collection and plotting is already done.
Bob, WB4APR
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed
are those of the author.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the
amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings:
http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
73 Rob PE1ITR http://www.pe1itr.com
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
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On 1 May 2007, at 22:36, SV1BSX wrote:
Gentlemans,
all these about TLM-capturing are good & rights, and yes, it's a reality for the birds like PACSAT, ANDE etc. as they already have AX.25.
But, at my opinion, the Analogue-Birds is other story. They have a different category of users. They are interesting mainly for QSOs, firstly. So, it's definitely a "bore job" for this kind of peoples to capture the TLM, when at the same time they can do "exciting" QSOs through the Satellite.
What about when the operator is asleep or in work?
Regards de John EI7IG
Maybe all satellites who don't want to monitor their own telemetry or construct an earth station system to do so should be launched with a transmitter that feeds into the APRS system?
I know this becomes more complicated but the rewards might outweigh (no pun intended) the negatives. As Bob pointed out, a system is in place, maybe satellites that produce life telemetry could standardize and plug into the system that already exists?
Roger WA1KAT
----- Original Message ----- From: "John Ronan" jronan@irishsystems.com To: "amsat bb" amsat-bb@amsat.org Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 7:02 PM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: The need for telemetry data -or what happened toFO-29-
On 1 May 2007, at 22:36, SV1BSX wrote:
Gentlemans,
all these about TLM-capturing are good & rights, and yes, it's a reality for the birds like PACSAT, ANDE etc. as they already have AX.25.
But, at my opinion, the Analogue-Birds is other story. They have a different category of users. They are interesting mainly for QSOs, firstly. So, it's definitely a "bore job" for this kind of peoples to capture the TLM, when at the same time they can do "exciting" QSOs through the Satellite.
What about when the operator is asleep or in work?
Regards de John EI7IG
Sent via AMSAT-BB@amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] The need for telemetry data -or what
Question: Are you proposing that all future satellites should send telemetry on the APRS frequency to make this system work?
Yes, no and maybe. The Global APRS network is there, the ground stations are there and listening, and it works. But even satellites that are not on the APRS satellite frequencies can be injected into the system as long as there are ground stations willing to tune their stations to the other satellites frequency for the duration of a pass. Once it is received, it does not matter what frquency it came in on, once it goes into the global APRS packet system, they all look the same.
I think the only limitation is that the telemetry must be an AX.25 packet...
Bob, WB4APR
Stefan
From: "Robert Bruninga" bruninga@usna.edu Reply-To: bruninga@usna.edu To: "'Stefan Wagener'" stefan_wagener@hotmail.com,
Subject: RE: [amsat-bb] The need for telemetry data -or what
happened to
FO-29- Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 11:03:55 -0400
...One key component of failure analysis is the availability of data, especially telemetry.
My question is, can the satellite user community at large come up with a system that allows the routine capturing of satellite telemetry? Is there a role that AMSAT can play? What would it take?
All of the APRS satellites (PCSAT-1, PCSAT2, ANDE and RAFT)
use
AX.25 and beacon their telemetry around the world. Any telemetry packets, heard by any station that is on the
internet,
feeds the packets live into the global APRS internet. Not
only
does this make it available to anyone at any time, but the
data
is also archived and is available in graphical form over any date period.
For example, Simple URL's can be constructed to access and
plot
any of the telemetry parameters. See this WEB page:
http://www.ew.usna.edu/~bruninga/andeTemps.html
And look at the source code. You will see that each plot is simply a URL constructed to access the correct period of data, and to select the range of values and the labels. This way, this
data
can be incorporated into any application. Thanks to the work
fof
K4HG, Steve Dimese and the FINDU system.
This is all hands-off, fully automated, and routine. Not
only
does it work for the satellites, but it can also plot all of this same data for ANY KPC-3+ TNC that is sending periodic telemetry packets anywhere in the world on any APRS
frequency.
For example, this simple URL will plot the telemetry for ANY KPC-3+ TNC on the air. This one is my local digipeater:
http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/tele2.cgi?call=wb4apr-1&last=240
Just change the ULR callsign to your TNC's callsign (if it is tramnsmitting its 5 channel telemetry beacons on any APRS frequency) and you will see it show up here. This is a fantastic system for quick-and-dirty experiments, since the global collection and plotting is already done.
Bob, WB4APR
participants (6)
-
John Ronan -
Rob Hardenberg -
Robert Bruninga -
Roger Kolakowski -
Stefan Wagener -
SV1BSX