Re: Satellite choices on Field Day
Hi Philip,
Happy to hear you are getting active again! Great.
One small precaution, based on personal experience during Field Day---be careful about creating expectations that can't be delivered...in other words, using the handheld system to listen to an FM bird is pretty easy, but on Field Day, it might be impossible to get a signal into the bird for a real contact.
When I've done demos on Field Day, I warn my observers that it's going to be quite busy, and while we certainly will hear the bird, it's unlikely with 5 watts that I'll make a contact *today*. But letting them hear the busy bird gets them interested, and has led to invitations to give a presentation/demo at a local club meeting---which CAN more easily lead to making some contacts (especially if you announce the event here on the BBS. People will look for you specifically, in order to make your event successful).
If you're going to have both the TS-2000x and the little radio, you could have somebody else waving it around to listen, while you operate the transmitter. It's fun to have audience participation!
Not sure I'll be on the air on Field Day, due to work---but best wishes for a great day.
Mark N8MH
At 11:03 PM 6/21/2012 -0400, Philip Jenkins wrote:
Thanks, Drew. I didn't realize AO-27's status, and I wasn't really looking forward to getting up in the middle of the night anyway :-) (although SO-50 has an excellent pass around 330 am :-) )
I did play around with AO-27 and SO-50 most of the day Wednesday, but yeah, I haven't really been active on the sats since a 1993 AO-13 DXpedition to VP2M.
The reason I'm planning on using the HT and Arrow is to show them the (nearly) minimum equipment that can be used to work a sat - that they don't have to have a fancy radio (IC 910, IC-9100, TS-2000) and a big antenna array to work the birds. (I do have switchable CP yagis on 2M and 440 at home, with an az/el rotor, but transporting all that would be too much logistically AND I thought it would be overkill and too intimidating for an audience whom you're trying to attract into ham radio.) But yeah, I'd much rather have full-duplex like I did on AO-13.
Philip
On Thu, Jun 21, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Andrew Glasbrenner < [email protected]> wrote:
I'm leaning towards AO-27 for listen only, as I know the bird will be jam packed with ops that weekend (although I do have a decent pass at 230 am local Sunday, and an even better one at 4 am) and actually trying to make
a
contact on SO-50, although I'm sure it will be busy too.
Let me save you some sleep. AO-27 is only on for the ascending passes in the afternoon, and only for 7 minutes starting at about 30 degrees latitude. This means the first several minutes of the afternoon pass will be silent from your QTH, and all of the overnight passes.
Definitely AO-7 for my linear choice, as I know the linear birds won't
be
as busy as the FM ones. FO-29 is my next choice.
FO-29 and VO-52 will work better on FD, as AO-7 tends to get overloaded easily.
I'm planning on using the Arrow antenna with my VX5-R for the FM birds,
and
I have an M-Squared 2M/440 (same boom, but offset 90 degrees) with an "armstrong" az/el control for the linear ones with my TS-2000X.
Why give up full duplex and the TS-2000 to use the VX5 on FM? Half-duplex is a poor choice for satellite on normal days, let alone Field Day. If it's because of the birdie, use the TS2000 as the transmitter and the VX5 for receive only.
Good luck. If you aren't a regular satellite user, try some passes outside of Field Day to improve your chances of success.
73, Drew KO4MA
Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Thanks, Mark. I've already made it clear to the other club members NOT to expect a successful sat QSO.
I'm going to make sure that my audience knows that too. One hands-on activity that I came up with (and I was already contemplating letting someone else use the Arrow, maybe a repeat visitor who has already seen my song and dance) - I have printed some copies of the grid-square map, and I'm hoping the children especially mark their map during the passes as they hear the grid-squares. I was astounded by how many grids I heard on just ONE AO-27 pass on Wednesday!
There are very few hams in the area where we're doing FD, which is one reason why we chose that location, to stir up interest.
Philip N4HF
On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 6:50 AM, Mark L. Hammond [email protected]wrote:
Hi Philip,
Happy to hear you are getting active again! Great.
One small precaution, based on personal experience during Field Day---be careful about creating expectations that can't be delivered...in other words, using the handheld system to listen to an FM bird is pretty easy, but on Field Day, it might be impossible to get a signal into the bird for a real contact.
When I've done demos on Field Day, I warn my observers that it's going to be quite busy, and while we certainly will hear the bird, it's unlikely with 5 watts that I'll make a contact *today*. But letting them hear the busy bird gets them interested, and has led to invitations to give a presentation/demo at a local club meeting---which CAN more easily lead to making some contacts (especially if you announce the event here on the BBS. People will look for you specifically, in order to make your event successful).
If you're going to have both the TS-2000x and the little radio, you could have somebody else waving it around to listen, while you operate the transmitter. It's fun to have audience participation!
Not sure I'll be on the air on Field Day, due to work---but best wishes for a great day.
Mark N8MH
At 11:03 PM 6/21/2012 -0400, Philip Jenkins wrote:
Thanks, Drew. I didn't realize AO-27's status, and I wasn't really looking forward to getting up in the middle of the night anyway :-) (although
SO-50
has an excellent pass around 330 am :-) )
I did play around with AO-27 and SO-50 most of the day Wednesday, but
yeah,
I haven't really been active on the sats since a 1993 AO-13 DXpedition to VP2M.
The reason I'm planning on using the HT and Arrow is to show them the (nearly) minimum equipment that can be used to work a sat - that they
don't
have to have a fancy radio (IC 910, IC-9100, TS-2000) and a big antenna array to work the birds. (I do have switchable CP yagis on 2M and 440 at home, with an az/el rotor, but transporting all that would be too much logistically AND I thought it would be overkill and too intimidating for
an
audience whom you're trying to attract into ham radio.) But yeah, I'd much rather have full-duplex like I did on AO-13.
Philip
On Thu, Jun 21, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Andrew Glasbrenner < [email protected]> wrote:
I'm leaning towards AO-27 for listen only, as I know the bird will be
jam
packed with ops that weekend (although I do have a decent pass at 230
am
local Sunday, and an even better one at 4 am) and actually trying to
make
a
contact on SO-50, although I'm sure it will be busy too.
Let me save you some sleep. AO-27 is only on for the ascending passes in the afternoon, and only for 7 minutes starting at about 30 degrees latitude. This means the first several minutes of the afternoon pass
will
be silent from your QTH, and all of the overnight passes.
Definitely AO-7 for my linear choice, as I know the linear birds
won't
be
as busy as the FM ones. FO-29 is my next choice.
FO-29 and VO-52 will work better on FD, as AO-7 tends to get overloaded easily.
I'm planning on using the Arrow antenna with my VX5-R for the FM birds,
and
I have an M-Squared 2M/440 (same boom, but offset 90 degrees) with an "armstrong" az/el control for the linear ones with my TS-2000X.
Why give up full duplex and the TS-2000 to use the VX5 on FM?
Half-duplex
is a poor choice for satellite on normal days, let alone Field Day. If
it's
because of the birdie, use the TS2000 as the transmitter and the VX5 for receive only.
Good luck. If you aren't a regular satellite user, try some passes
outside
of Field Day to improve your chances of success.
73, Drew KO4MA
Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
We have been able to do it with a handheld for the last 5 years. But we may have geography in our favor :-)
THE FOLLOWING COMMENT IS FOR NEXT YEAR!
Has anyone considering re-examining the FM satellite rule? I would like to propose the following:
Contacts on the FM satellites can only be made with W1AW and K6KPH. Those stations could get on with solid signals and pass out contacts. No other contacts would count. I believe more contacts would be made, and it would be better to listen to as well. We would have to get the word out early and often.
Just My Thoughts, Joe kk0sd
-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Philip Jenkins Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:31 AM To: Mark L. Hammond Cc: [email protected] Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Satellite choices on Field Day
Thanks, Mark. I've already made it clear to the other club members NOT to expect a successful sat QSO.
I'm going to make sure that my audience knows that too. One hands-on activity that I came up with (and I was already contemplating letting someone else use the Arrow, maybe a repeat visitor who has already seen my song and dance) - I have printed some copies of the grid-square map, and I'm hoping the children especially mark their map during the passes as they hear the grid-squares. I was astounded by how many grids I heard on just ONE AO-27 pass on Wednesday!
There are very few hams in the area where we're doing FD, which is one reason why we chose that location, to stir up interest.
Philip N4HF
On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 6:50 AM, Mark L. Hammond [email protected]wrote:
Hi Philip,
Happy to hear you are getting active again! Great.
One small precaution, based on personal experience during Field Day---be careful about creating expectations that can't be delivered...in other words, using the handheld system to listen to an FM bird is pretty easy, but on Field Day, it might be impossible to get a signal into the bird for a real contact.
When I've done demos on Field Day, I warn my observers that it's going to be quite busy, and while we certainly will hear the bird, it's unlikely with 5 watts that I'll make a contact *today*. But letting them hear the busy bird gets them interested, and has led to invitations to give a presentation/demo at a local club meeting---which CAN more easily lead to making some contacts (especially if you announce the event here on the
BBS.
People will look for you specifically, in order to make your event successful).
If you're going to have both the TS-2000x and the little radio, you could have somebody else waving it around to listen, while you operate the transmitter. It's fun to have audience participation!
Not sure I'll be on the air on Field Day, due to work---but best wishes for a great day.
Mark N8MH
At 11:03 PM 6/21/2012 -0400, Philip Jenkins wrote:
Thanks, Drew. I didn't realize AO-27's status, and I wasn't really
looking
forward to getting up in the middle of the night anyway :-) (although
SO-50
has an excellent pass around 330 am :-) )
I did play around with AO-27 and SO-50 most of the day Wednesday, but
yeah,
I haven't really been active on the sats since a 1993 AO-13 DXpedition to VP2M.
The reason I'm planning on using the HT and Arrow is to show them the (nearly) minimum equipment that can be used to work a sat - that they
don't
have to have a fancy radio (IC 910, IC-9100, TS-2000) and a big antenna array to work the birds. (I do have switchable CP yagis on 2M and 440 at home, with an az/el rotor, but transporting all that would be too much logistically AND I thought it would be overkill and too intimidating for
an
audience whom you're trying to attract into ham radio.) But yeah, I'd
much
rather have full-duplex like I did on AO-13.
Philip
On Thu, Jun 21, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Andrew Glasbrenner < [email protected]> wrote:
I'm leaning towards AO-27 for listen only, as I know the bird will be
jam
packed with ops that weekend (although I do have a decent pass at 230
am
local Sunday, and an even better one at 4 am) and actually trying to
make
a
contact on SO-50, although I'm sure it will be busy too.
Let me save you some sleep. AO-27 is only on for the ascending passes
in
the afternoon, and only for 7 minutes starting at about 30 degrees latitude. This means the first several minutes of the afternoon pass
will
be silent from your QTH, and all of the overnight passes.
Definitely AO-7 for my linear choice, as I know the linear birds
won't
be
as busy as the FM ones. FO-29 is my next choice.
FO-29 and VO-52 will work better on FD, as AO-7 tends to get overloaded easily.
I'm planning on using the Arrow antenna with my VX5-R for the FM
birds,
and
I have an M-Squared 2M/440 (same boom, but offset 90 degrees) with an "armstrong" az/el control for the linear ones with my TS-2000X.
Why give up full duplex and the TS-2000 to use the VX5 on FM?
Half-duplex
is a poor choice for satellite on normal days, let alone Field Day. If
it's
because of the birdie, use the TS2000 as the transmitter and the VX5
for
receive only.
Good luck. If you aren't a regular satellite user, try some passes
outside
of Field Day to improve your chances of success.
73, Drew KO4MA
Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Wont work because there would be a 1000 ops calling 1 station,and field day is about contacting many stations but on staellites only 1 contact is needed for 300 points. Make the 1 contact and shut down your satellite station and let the rest of us have our 1 contact and shut down also. I hope the BIG GUN Satellite Stations will not use there amps to cut through the pile ups. I thing the satellite stations should not use any thing over 50 watts max on FM or better yet only use 5 watts and a hand held. After all Field Day is about emergency comm. and not blasting everyone out Thats my thoughts . See everyone at the same time on the birds LOL I will be operating W4BS in em55 for those that may still be trying to get there 5 in em55 award 73 Damon WA4HFN
----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary "Joe" Mayfield" [email protected] Cc: [email protected] Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 8:17:57 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Satellite choices on Field Day
We have been able to do it with a handheld for the last 5 years. But we may have geography in our favor :-)
THE FOLLOWING COMMENT IS FOR NEXT YEAR!
Has anyone considering re-examining the FM satellite rule? I would like to propose the following:
Contacts on the FM satellites can only be made with W1AW and K6KPH. Those stations could get on with solid signals and pass out contacts. No other contacts would count. I believe more contacts would be made, and it would be better to listen to as well. We would have to get the word out early and often.
Just My Thoughts, Joe kk0sd
-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Philip Jenkins Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:31 AM To: Mark L. Hammond Cc: [email protected] Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: Satellite choices on Field Day
Thanks, Mark. I've already made it clear to the other club members NOT to expect a successful sat QSO.
I'm going to make sure that my audience knows that too. One hands-on activity that I came up with (and I was already contemplating letting someone else use the Arrow, maybe a repeat visitor who has already seen my song and dance) - I have printed some copies of the grid-square map, and I'm hoping the children especially mark their map during the passes as they hear the grid-squares. I was astounded by how many grids I heard on just ONE AO-27 pass on Wednesday!
There are very few hams in the area where we're doing FD, which is one reason why we chose that location, to stir up interest.
Philip N4HF
On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 6:50 AM, Mark L. Hammond [email protected]wrote:
Hi Philip,
Happy to hear you are getting active again! Great.
One small precaution, based on personal experience during Field Day---be careful about creating expectations that can't be delivered...in other words, using the handheld system to listen to an FM bird is pretty easy, but on Field Day, it might be impossible to get a signal into the bird for a real contact.
When I've done demos on Field Day, I warn my observers that it's going to be quite busy, and while we certainly will hear the bird, it's unlikely with 5 watts that I'll make a contact *today*. But letting them hear the busy bird gets them interested, and has led to invitations to give a presentation/demo at a local club meeting---which CAN more easily lead to making some contacts (especially if you announce the event here on the
BBS.
People will look for you specifically, in order to make your event successful).
If you're going to have both the TS-2000x and the little radio, you could have somebody else waving it around to listen, while you operate the transmitter. It's fun to have audience participation!
Not sure I'll be on the air on Field Day, due to work---but best wishes for a great day.
Mark N8MH
At 11:03 PM 6/21/2012 -0400, Philip Jenkins wrote:
Thanks, Drew. I didn't realize AO-27's status, and I wasn't really
looking
forward to getting up in the middle of the night anyway :-) (although
SO-50
has an excellent pass around 330 am :-) )
I did play around with AO-27 and SO-50 most of the day Wednesday, but
yeah,
I haven't really been active on the sats since a 1993 AO-13 DXpedition to VP2M.
The reason I'm planning on using the HT and Arrow is to show them the (nearly) minimum equipment that can be used to work a sat - that they
don't
have to have a fancy radio (IC 910, IC-9100, TS-2000) and a big antenna array to work the birds. (I do have switchable CP yagis on 2M and 440 at home, with an az/el rotor, but transporting all that would be too much logistically AND I thought it would be overkill and too intimidating for
an
audience whom you're trying to attract into ham radio.) But yeah, I'd
much
rather have full-duplex like I did on AO-13.
Philip
On Thu, Jun 21, 2012 at 10:36 PM, Andrew Glasbrenner < [email protected]> wrote:
I'm leaning towards AO-27 for listen only, as I know the bird will be
jam
packed with ops that weekend (although I do have a decent pass at 230
am
local Sunday, and an even better one at 4 am) and actually trying to
make
a
contact on SO-50, although I'm sure it will be busy too.
Let me save you some sleep. AO-27 is only on for the ascending passes
in
the afternoon, and only for 7 minutes starting at about 30 degrees latitude. This means the first several minutes of the afternoon pass
will
be silent from your QTH, and all of the overnight passes.
Definitely AO-7 for my linear choice, as I know the linear birds
won't
be
as busy as the FM ones. FO-29 is my next choice.
FO-29 and VO-52 will work better on FD, as AO-7 tends to get overloaded easily.
I'm planning on using the Arrow antenna with my VX5-R for the FM
birds,
and
I have an M-Squared 2M/440 (same boom, but offset 90 degrees) with an "armstrong" az/el control for the linear ones with my TS-2000X.
Why give up full duplex and the TS-2000 to use the VX5 on FM?
Half-duplex
is a poor choice for satellite on normal days, let alone Field Day. If
it's
because of the birdie, use the TS2000 as the transmitter and the VX5
for
receive only.
Good luck. If you aren't a regular satellite user, try some passes
outside
of Field Day to improve your chances of success.
73, Drew KO4MA
Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
_______________________________________________ Sent via [email protected]. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
Hi Joe!
We have been able to do it with a handheld for the last 5 years. But we may have geography in our favor :-)
If I pick my "battles" (passes) right, I also benefit from geography here in the southwest. I won't even bother with any AO-27 passes to the east of me, and will hope to sneak in a QSO on SO-50 before its footprint covers much of the US. I operate 1B/1-Op/Battery at 5W on HF and 6m as well as the birds, so you can imagine the challenges in getting through without the benefit of higher power. Operating experience does play a big part in making the QSOs, especially with the conditions we will hear this weekend.
On the SSB birds, I may try to work some eastern passes. I was not as successful on SSB last year compared to 2010. The high-power stations that monopolize the FM birds cripple the SSB transponders, unfortunately. But that's part of the challenge, getting through in less-than-ideal conditions....
THE FOLLOWING COMMENT IS FOR NEXT YEAR!
Has anyone considering re-examining the FM satellite rule? I would like to propose the following:
Contacts on the FM satellites can only be made with W1AW and K6KPH. Those stations could get on with solid signals and pass out contacts. No other contacts would count. I believe more contacts would be made, and it would be better to listen to as well. We would have to get the word out early and often.
If you are going to limit stations to contacts with a very few stations on the FM birds, that would put those satellites in a completely different class compared to the SSB birds or other bands. At that point, you might as well exclude the FM birds like 3 HF bands (12m, 17m, 30m) are excluded from Field Day and most other HF contests. I'd rather not see that happen, even with the chaotic conditions on many of those FM satellite passes. Again, that's part of the challenge.
During last year's Field Day, there was a very nice AO-51 pass over the west coast late on Saturday afternoon. Stations were able to make their Field Day QSOs, and a couple were even looking to exchange grid locators and not participating in Field Day! Geography played a big role in that pass, with not much of the footprint going east of the Rockies. Good operating by all on that pass also contributed to that pass not being crazy like others were.
I'll try to make my 1 QSO on AO-27 and SO-50 tomorrow. If other stations call me after I've logged my single QSO, I will attempt to respond and get the other station a satellite QSO. I never score the additional FM satellite QSOs when I submit my reports to ARRL and AMSAT, but the QSOs are listed so I have a complete log of my Field Day effort in my reports.
I will be in the forest somewhere around Flagstaff AZ for Field Day, probably in grid DM45. I should be able to work some passes before the 1800 UTC start of Field Day at the DM35/DM45 grid boundary for those wanting log a QSO with either - or both - of those grids (probably in the 1430-1730 UTC timeframe). Keep an eye on APRS at http://aprs.fi/wd9ewk-9 to get an idea of where I am for those earlier passes, and updates will also be posted on Twitter using @WD9EWK or at http://twitter.com/wd9ewk
73!
Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/
Don't forget that a good way of coping with the crowds on the linear birds is to use CW. These aren't just SSB birds, you know, and you may get some of the CW ops interested in satellite operation. I think that the linear birds are so much more useful for FD than the FM birds that I encourage everyone to try them. It may take a pass or two to learn to cope with tuning and doppler, but you will find the ease at making multiple contacts worth it. Look for W5UR. - KK6MC
----- Original Message -----
Hi All,
I am planning a similar operation with the Tri-County ARC (WC5C). There are a few of us who get on satellite and we are going to bring out all manner of antennas from Arrows to Lindenblads to small yagis to big yagis, and while having a "reliable" station with the bigger antennas and FT-736R we plan to let anyone and everyone try their radio be it an HT or an all band rig with the antennas we have or whatever they bring, to experience listening to any maybe making contact (no promises) through any of the satellites. An opportunity to see what can be done with various levels of equipment/investment/skill and learn about how the different satellites/antennas work in various conditions. A free for all but backed up with some more "reliable" Q for those who want to sit down and try the linear birds as well as making some FD points. It should be crazy! But I hope to give lots of people the opportunity to play rather than in the past, where many would just watch quietly as we operated and ask questions now and then. Many are shy, but given encouragement and a challenge I think they might like to see what they can learn and accomplish hands-on.
73, Jerry N0JY
On 6/22/2012 6:31 AM, Philip Jenkins wrote:
Thanks, Mark. I've already made it clear to the other club members NOT to expect a successful sat QSO.
I'm going to make sure that my audience knows that too. One hands-on activity that I came up with (and I was already contemplating letting someone else use the Arrow, maybe a repeat visitor who has already seen my song and dance) - I have printed some copies of the grid-square map, and I'm hoping the children especially mark their map during the passes as they hear the grid-squares. I was astounded by how many grids I heard on just ONE AO-27 pass on Wednesday!
There are very few hams in the area where we're doing FD, which is one reason why we chose that location, to stir up interest.
Philip N4HF
On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 6:50 AM, Mark L. Hammond [email protected]wrote:
Hi Philip,
Happy to hear you are getting active again! Great.
One small precaution, based on personal experience during Field Day---be careful about creating expectations that can't be delivered...in other words, using the handheld system to listen to an FM bird is pretty easy, but on Field Day, it might be impossible to get a signal into the bird for a real contact.
When I've done demos on Field Day, I warn my observers that it's going to be quite busy, and while we certainly will hear the bird, it's unlikely with 5 watts that I'll make a contact *today*. But letting them hear the busy bird gets them interested, and has led to invitations to give a presentation/demo at a local club meeting---which CAN more easily lead to making some contacts (especially if you announce the event here on the BBS. People will look for you specifically, in order to make your event successful).
If you're going to have both the TS-2000x and the little radio, you could have somebody else waving it around to listen, while you operate the transmitter. It's fun to have audience participation!
Not sure I'll be on the air on Field Day, due to work---but best wishes for a great day.
Mark N8MH
participants (7)
-
Gary "Joe" Mayfield -
jamesduffey＠comcast.net -
Mark L. Hammond -
N0JY -
Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) -
Philip Jenkins -
wa4hfn＠comcast.net