December 2008 - AMSAT-BB - mailman.amsat.org

Re: Building an EggBeater
by Alan Sieg WB5RMG 29 Dec '08

29 Dec '08

PE0SAT said : > Does anybody have a good article from building an Eggbeater > for 144 and 435 MHz? I have built several of these in the past (Eggbeater II by K5OE), and currently have two in the attic - one each for 145 and 435. They serve me well, both for satellites and horizontal-omni for VHF contest. I have no outside antennae currently, but the 144 version I built for my Dad 6 years ago is still intact atop his 50 ft tower. I will probably paint the PVC on the next ones I build for outdoor service. The original website is gone, but I recently found a mirror site : http://www.observations.biz/K5OE/ look for Eggbeater link. Construction is simple, the given dimensions worked well for me. Hopefully you have or can locate some RG-62 (93 Ohm) for phasing loops. Build the 70cm version first, as the smaller elements are easier to handle. The experience will help in construction of the 2m version. I currently have no other antennae for comparison, but these are an improvement over simple verticals. I appreciate the fact that they provide horizontal polarization at the horizon - as I also enjoy the VHF contests. Receive preamps are nice if you have them. (no need for a rotator either) On satellite, I use a Yaesu FT-736R (25~30 watts), about 60 feet of good air-dialectric coax for each, and these two Eggbeaters. I typically only operate on VO-52 as I prefer linear modes... I have been away from the birds for several years, but I am now returning - thanks to these antennae... Good luck, enjoy - and let us know how you progress. Thanks /;^) -- <- Licensed in 1976, WB5RMG = Alan Sieg * AMSAT#20554 -> <- http://www.somenet.net * http://wb5rmg.somenet.net -> <- http://www.linkedin.com/in/alansieg * My 'Day Job' ->

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my arrow
by andy thomas 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

Well, my Arrow took me from a clifftop in Cornwall with a THD7E at 5w to PCSAT at a 2 degree elevation and down to Maine as Bob will doubtless remember... 73 de andy g0SFJ

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Re: Arrow Antenna
by Clint Bradford 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

.. Ducting could explain the performance in the tropics ... Heck, Tim and I worked AO-51 a couple months ago ... He's in the South, I'm in Southern CA. 2200 miles or so - no record by any means - but we were both using HTs and those horrible Arrow Antennas. I believe Tim stated it was a three degree elevation pass for him ... I need to drop out of this group for a while. Seeing folks suggest adding a wing nut here and a washer there and making wild, unsubstantiated claims as to the Arrow's duplexer's loss makes me want to scream. Meanwhile, I'll be watching the San Diego Chargers blow away their opponents this evening, and sneak out and work AO-51 at the end of the first quarter. And so it goes .... Clint Bradford

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Re: Arrow Antenna
by Clint Bradford 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

> > I've noticed some "Arrow" discussion on the BBS. I am not a real > technical ham but I do know that I can routinely hit the mainland > from Hawaii at 1 degree elevation with the Arrow (ask K7WIN). Nope. Sorry. You are wrong. The engineers here state that that type of performance from an Arrow Antenna is impossible. You are deluded. Other engineers here state that you would really be pleased with the performance of the Arrow if it were polarized differently. Anywhere from 3-to-20dB increase in signal strength. So your "1 degree elevation" passes you are successfully working are nothin' ... Removing tongue from my cheek, Clint Bradford, K6LCS / KAF3359 909-241-7666

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Fw: ELK or ARROW
by Jim Danehy 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

. there is the old adage that you get what you pay for . . . why buy a poorly designed antenna that does not work very well > ? > > If you have a 5 element yagi that only produces 4 dbi you are not getting > what you paid for . . . most 2 element yagis would out perform that > statistic . . . a 5 element yagi should be at least 9 db + or 10 db dbd > (dipole ) not isotropic . . . . there is something that is called > MERCHANTABILITY . . .i.e., an IMPLIED WARRANTY that you are getting at > least the minimum for your money . . . > 4 dbi for an Arrow is way off base . . . so it is not just ; you can not > afford a Cadillac but you are not even getting a Ford or Chevy . . i.e., > the gain of a 5 element yagi on 435 mhz . . . that is the issue, not cost > alone . . . . . . same comments apply to the ELK but I have attempted to > make the point that there is a minimum performance for a certain number of > elements that is pretty OBJECTIVE and when it is not met . . . . well > that is my point . . . these two antennas have shown to some testers that > they do not measure up to the minimum EXPECTATIONS . . .unfortunately that > is acceptable to some . . . . then it becomes acceptable to many . . . > and objectivity is abandoned . . . > > Jim W9VNE > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Trey Brown" <palintheus(a)gmail.com> > To: "Jim Danehy" <jdanehy(a)cinci.rr.com> > Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 6:39 PM > Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] ELK or ARROW > > >> Thanks for the comments. Realize, though, that not everyone wants or >> can afford to have the Cadillac. >> >> >> On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Jim Danehy <jdanehy(a)cinci.rr.com> wrote: >>> the Arrow antenna has been critiqued by Kent Britain, WA5VJB >>> >>> http://wa5vjb.com/references/Cheap%20Antennas-LEOs.pdf >>> >>> he says that some have measured the Arrow for gain on 435 mhz @ 4 dbi >>> (isotropic) . . . . and that further analysis showed that for the >>> element lengths used on 435 mhz that it peaks at 457 mhz and not 435 mhz >>> . . . Kent is a well respected VHF/UHF antenna person who has plenty of >>> credibility . . . >>> >>> Kent opines that the Arrow, as built does not have its elements >>> insulated from the boom. It uses dimensions for insulated elements . . . >>> so much for the Arrow . . . . >>> >>> Now for the ELK : a local friend of mine owns an Arrow and he uses it >>> successfully. He bought an ELK and attempted to compare the Arrow and >>> the ELK . . . . he could not make an across town QSO on 435 mhz from his >>> second story window with the ELK , so he sent the ELK back for a refund >>> . >>> >>> I have worked and exchanged QSLs with several hundred satellite users . >>> . .the majority of the folks that have worked and QSLed me (close to 250 >>> + ) have been using either the Arrow or ELK based upon the information >>> on their cards. So they are popular. Are they optimum ? A lot of >>> anecdotal information would seem to say NO . . . >>> >>> Thirty-five years ago I worked Oscar 6 with a homebrew 2 mtr yagi that >>> probably was worse than either the Arrow or Elk but I worked YV and KL7 >>> from Indiana on CW with about 15 watts to the 3 elements which my XYL >>> waved around at my directions . . . not any more . . .what do I use >>> these days : a pair of circular polarity yagis on 10 foot booms >>> manufactured by M Square . . . . >>> >>> Folks ask what should they buy ? Maybe a Ford or maybe a Chevy . . . >>> neither is a Cadillac . . . . >>> >>> Jim W9VNE >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sent via AMSAT-BB(a)amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. >>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite >>> program! >>> Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Trey -- N5THX >> >> They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary >> safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. >> - Benjamin Franklin >> >

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Elk or Arrow
by Jim Leder 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

Wow, did this topic ever take a weird turn! Jim Bob Buckeye AKA **** Jim Leder**** K8CXM since 1961 IBM retiree since 1999 There are 10 types of people in this world -- those who understand binary and those who don't.

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ISS V/U Pass
by Scott Schmautz 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

Just heard a nice pass of the ISS in V/U repeater mode, nice and strong on the HT. Astronaut Mike was working the pile nicely! Could hear the stations he was in QSO with on the downlink quite well. He said L band later today. Scott/WB2UZR --

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NA1SS today
by Perry Yantis 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

NA1SS is on 145.99 up 437.800 dn today will go to 1269.65 up and 145.800 down later today. Perry WB8OTH

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Possible YUBILEINY RS-30 event
by andy thomas 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

Following on from Mike DK3WN's successful intercept, I think there's a possibility of a Yubileiny RS-30 broadcast event on January 2nd or 4th 2009. January 2nd 1959 (50 years ago) saw the launch of MECHTA (Dream) -renamed LUNA-1 - which missed the Moon but established two things (according to the 'net): the Moon has no magnetic field and that the solar wind streamed into space. AMSATters will be pleased to hear that it was also the best dx to date (Moon to earth and beyond!) See for example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luna_1 http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/nmc/masterCatalog.do?sc=1959-012A On January 4th she was the first man made object to leave the Earth's orbit. I have no tip-off, but a gut feeling that it might be worth a listen on 435.315 or .215 NBFM on the anniversary?? 73 de andy g0sfj

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Re: Building an EggBeater
by John Marranca, Jr 28 Dec '08

28 Dec '08

If I may be so brazen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1u7aoHDc-gw&feature=channel_page Good Luck John KB2HSH -- _______________________________ John Marranca, Jr PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122 BN Systems, Inc Orchard Park, NY (716)972-2006

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