October 2011 - AMSAT-BB - mailman.amsat.org

Re: There's no usable satellites
by Andrew Glasbrenner 24 Oct '11

24 Oct '11

Hi, Expect a ton of information to be presented at Symposium. I can assure you the Fox team is working very hard on the project design and hardware now, papers and presentations for Symposium, and also preparing proposals for low-cost launch opportunities that are due with a few weeks. 73, Drew KO4MA -----Original Message----- >From: Thomas Schaefer <thomasmschaefer(a)gmail.com> >Sent: Oct 24, 2011 11:56 AM >To: "Bato,Andras" <bato(a)starjan.hu> >Cc: amsat-bb(a)amsat.org >Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: There's no usable satellites > >I suspended my project to install a satellite beam and rotor because of the state of affairs. I guess I can donate more money but it is hard when the web pages for the current projects do not seem to be updated as much (yes, I know…volunteers). Maybe someone can tell me… > >Are there updated, realistic timeframes posted on a website? >Is there a fund raising indicate to tell how close of far AMSAT is from their goal to launch the next satellite.? > >It appears people want to help. > >Case in point…the Project Fox website which was updated last on August 2011 states under the following under Project Status Updates: Watch this space as we progress. That's it. Not even the status updates that were given at Dayton. > >Is there no progress? If the project is simply waiting until enough seed money is collected, then would it be possible to show that target? Maybe indicate what has been collected this month, last month, and this year? How far do we have to go? What is the next milestone and what is it waiting upon to start/finish. > >I did see a number $800 on the logo where one can donate. Is that how much has been collected? > >Non-professional fund raising has ben going on for a long time. Having basic feedback mechanisms encourages people to give. If they see how their contribution will add to a milestone being started/finished, it helps. I know it takes time and resources to do this, but ultimately, the fund raising is a big part I presume. > >Now if I am wrong and the project is waiting for a grant or a free rocket ride to either bother, then let's see that status. > > >Note I read the Project Fox presentation given at Dayton and it did not mention funding targets except to state the obvious that launch costs have gone up. We need real numbers and to see how far it will take to get there. I think more people can rally around the project with some goals in mind. > >Regards, >

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Sunday US ARISSAT Pass
by Jeff Welsh 24 Oct '11

24 Oct '11

Did anyone notice the apparent reset of ARISSAT yesterday during it's mid-afternoon US pass? I was in the process of setting up for telemetry reception when the bird seemed to drop out completely and come back online about 1-2 minutes later. Just curious if it is a schedule rest period for the transmitters. --jeff N3QO

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Re: Why should we support AMSAT?
by Daniel Schultz 24 Oct '11

24 Oct '11

Stefan, I wasn't trying to diminish the students, but I have worked with a student satellite project where they literally took a chip maker's application note for a baby monitor or cordless telephone transmitter and made a satellite transmitter out of it, and it didn't work on orbit. I appreciate the students energy and enthusiasm, but in some cases they do have much to learn about RF. I also remember how valuable my amateur radio background was to me when I was an engineering student, when some of my classmates couldn't even read the color bands on a resistor and had no idea how the theory that we were studying was applied to real world applications. I am also concerned about whether the students are receiving the right kind of experience to prepare them for the aerospace industry. They get to make all the design decisions and direct their entire project, but when they are hired by Lockheed Martin or some other large aerospace company they will be doing mind numbing paperwork and will have little power to make engineering decisions, particularly on government contracts. I also know about this from years of experience. They also are not learning the political skills that they will need to have to survive in the corporate world, where career success depends more on how you suck up to authority than on your ability to design or build anything. I am not diminishing the students, I love the students and want them to succeed better than I did, but I have much experience, not all of it positive, that I feel I should share with them during their formative years. Dan ------ Original Message ------ Received: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 09:18:48 AM EDT From: Stefan Wagener <wageners(a)gmail.com> To: Daniel Schultz <n8fgv(a)usa.net>Cc: amsat-bb(a)amsat.org Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Why should we support AMSAT? > Hi Dan, > > You have some good points and your thoughts are appreciated. But why > are you diminishing the students efforts by making these statements: > > At least they are building, studying, learning and actually many times > successfully have an operational satellite. > > Thanks for reading. > > Stefan, VE4NSA

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Why should we support AMSAT?
by Daniel Schultz 24 Oct '11

24 Oct '11

> Why should we support AMSAT. I already have a cell phone. I could give you > my number. We could set up a conference call. Everyone can talk and listen > ...worldwide....and interrupt each other....for a lot less cost than > putting up our own satellite. Better yet... there is the > internet...Skype...complete with video. We can talk all over the world. > Why should we spend money on our own satellites when somebody else > has already paid the bill? No pile-ups,...Problem solved. :-)) > > KM9U...just a fellow amateur wondering why. ;-)) President Kennedy answered your question better than I can: "But why, some say, the moon? Why choose this as our goal?...... We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win" Now replace "We choose to go to the moon" with "We choose to design and build our own satellites" and all the rest of the words apply just as well to us, 50 years later. If you just want to make phone calls, you don't need to be a ham. Ham radio is for the one kid in 100 who wants to pry the lid off the box and see how the magic works. The amateur radio satellite community paved the way for all of the small satellites that came later. Amsat alumni founded many of the companies that are now active in the small satellite business, the same industry which has now bid up the price of secondary launches to a point where we can no longer afford to launch satellites by passing the hat and selling software and t-shirts at hamfests. Why support Fox? Fox will send a message to the CubeSat community that they should set their sights higher than that of building short lived beepsats that are considered successful if they transmit a signal for one day before going silent. The engineering needed to build a satellite for a 5 year or longer mission will be eye-opening to some of these groups. The RF system must be engineered for space flight, not adapted from data sheets and application notes that are better suited for baby monitors or garage door openers, or taking the plastic case off of a store bought handietalkie and hoping that it will perform on orbit. We can use the energy and enthusiasm of the student satellite builders, and they can learn from our 50 years of experience in satellite communications. FOX is a way for Amsat to show off our engineering prowess to the rest of the satellite world. Providing communications packages ready to drop into a new satellite could be our ticket in the future. If we can find a university or agency that wants to put their experiment into HEO but doesn't want the hassle of designing their communications system, that could be our ticket back to HEO. Dan Schultz N8FGV

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VUCC #223
by Stephen E. Belter 23 Oct '11

23 Oct '11

I'm pleased to report that my ARRL Satellite VHF/UHF Century Club (VUCC) certificate #223 has arrived. My VUCC application with 60 LoTW contacts was submitted on September 6th. My 74 QSL cards were checked by Patti, AF9H, a volunteer VHF Awards Manager in Illinois on September 9th. My award was printed on October 5th. My thanks to Patti and to Sharon at ARRL Headquarters for their help in getting the paperwork processed. I also want to thank all of the stations who helped me with my contacts, especially the stations who confirmed our contact with a QSL card or LoTW entry. If you haven't used Logbook of the World (LoTW) or if you haven't used it recently, I encourage you to try it. Getting confirmation of a contact within a few hours of the QSO is great! (The ARRL accepts LoTW contacts for VUCC and WAS; it does not accept eQSL or qrz.com logbook entries.) Special thanks go to these stations who have gone portable to give all of us the opportunity to work additional grids. (I'm now at 249 grids worked and 182 confirmed.) Here is my list of stations that I've worked from multiple grid locations: 13 - W5PFG Clayton 10 - ND9M Jim 10 - WD9EWK Patrick 7 - N0JE Gerry 6 - N3YKF Norm 6 - W5JYM Jim 6 - WC7V Kerry 5 - AC0RA Wyatt 5 - K5OE Jerry 5 - KB0RZD Gail 5 - KC0YBM Chris 5 - VA3OR Kevin 4 - K0BAM Jim 4 - KD0BJT Dan 4 - WA4NVM Damon 4 - WA5DA Wadhah 4 - WA5KBH George 3 - AA5CK Ted 3 - KD8CAO Doug 3 - KG6NUB Sawson 3 - NX9B Jeff 3 - XE1AY Ismael 2 - CO6CBF Hector 2 - K3NXH Chuck 2 - K8BL Bob 2 - K8YSE John 2 - KA6SIP Tom 2 - KB1RVT Nick 2 - KB2M Jeff 2 - KB5WIA Dave 2 - KD0JWY Rich 2 - KF7MYK Kevin 2 - KI6YAA Larry 2 - KL7R Dale 2 - KO4MA Drew 2 - VA3CIB Stephan 2 - W5MPC Mike 2 - W9EN John 2 - XE1AO Omar My point with this list is not only to thank these friends for their effort, but to also illustrate that there are a lot of people going the extra mile to improve their skills by operating away from their home QTH. 73 and I hope to work you on the birds! Steve N9IP --

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WD9EWK satellite activity on Saturday (22 October)
by Patrick STODDARD (WD9EWK/VA7EWK) 23 Oct '11

23 Oct '11

Hi! Another Saturday not in the summertime, another Arizona hamfest, and another road trip to different parts of the state. Yesterday was a fun day, with perfect weather for the Old Pueblo Radio Club's hamfest in Tucson yesterday morning, followed by a few hours in southeastern Arizona working satellites from the DM51bx/DM52ba grid boundary, and a drive out to a different spot in the rarely-heard grid DM53 in eastern Arizona. Saturday morning at the hamfest was crowded. More people seemed to be out this year than at last year's hamfest. The parking lot used for the hamfest was full, if that's any gauge (it hasn't been, for the past few years since I started going to this hamfest). For the first time since I've been representing AMSAT at hamfests in almost 5 years, all of my satellite demonstrations were done on the SSB birds. With AO-51's pass times gradually moving earlier and earlier as the years have passed, and SO-50 not passing by in the morning except for one pass that overlapped an AO-7 pass, I made good use of both AO-7 and VO-52. AO-7 was in mode B, and that - along with the reliable VO-52 - made great impressions on the people watching. Thanks to the stations that called and worked me during the morning, and I apologize if I missed some of you on those passes. By 11am (1800 UTC), the hamfest was almost vacant. I packed up my stuff, stopped for a quick lunch down the street from the hamfest, then it was off to the DM51bx/DM52ba grid boundary just over an hour away from Tucson. I was able to get out there in time for the AO-27 pass around 2006 UTC, and have lots of time to spare. Working 5 passes (two each on AO-27 and AO-51, plus an AO-7 pass) while enjoying the Saturday afternoon in southeastern Arizona was enjoyable. Even the time between passes after updating my logbook doing nothing more than sitting back and listening to some music before the next pass. After the last AO-51 pass around 2330 UTC, I had almost 2 1/2 hours before the SO-50 pass I planned to work at the DM52ax/DM53aa grid boundary. As I was driving up toward DM53, I started poking around on my sat-nav system and noticed that I might be able to help a couple of other satellite operators work a very rare Arizona county via satellite and still be in grid DM53. Greenlee County, along Arizona's eastern border with New Mexico, is the smallest in population (less than 8000). Its county seat, Clifton, has about half of that - and a big copper mine. Most of the town is hemmed in by mountains, but I was able to find a dirt road off the main highway (US-191, the Coronado Trail - previously known as US-666) in grid DM53ia that kept me up higher than most of Clifton and have a better shot at working the two passes I planned for - SO-50 at 0155 UTC, followed by VO-52 at 0220 UTC. Once I heard SO-50, I was able to work stations from central Mexico and all across the USA in about 10 minutes. Many were happy with the DM53 QSO, and a few got the one Arizona county that had eluded them on the satellites. VO-52 a few minutes after the SO-50 pass was also good. I'm still working on my log for those two passes, but I was able to work stations from start to finish on each pass. A good way to wrap up the radio part of my quick road trip. After finishing up the radio operating, it was back in the truck for a drive home of almost 4 hours including a fuel stop. Including my drive to Tucson on Friday evening in advance of the hamfest, this was a 524-mile (843km) road trip and activity from 4 grids (hamfest was in grid DM42me, along with the DM5x grids activated after the hamfest). I looked at my APRS track for the trip, and I am happy to see that my entire trip was picked up by the APRS network out here. Lots of mountaintop digipeaters, and many APRS gateways to feed the APRS RF network into the Internet, here in Arizona. For those that missed out on working me in those grids, I will be back in Tucson for another hamfest in the spring (late March or early April, date hasn't been determined yet) and a hamfest in Sierra Vista (southeast of Tucson) in May. I take advantage of these events to visit the grids in southeastern Arizona that are rarely heard on the satellites, and I plan on doing it again for those two events next spring. If there are any county hunters that would like to hear Greenlee County on the birds again, I might be able to plan another road trip in that direction. Time to finish updating my log from last night, and then printing up more QSL cards.... and, yes, this was fun. :-) 73! Patrick WD9EWK/VA7EWK http://www.wd9ewk.net/ P.S.: The Arizona Worked All Counties award is available for those who make contacts with all 15 Arizona counties. Contacts via satellite are specifically permitted. I have now been on the satellites from 14 of the 15 counties over the past few years, and Leo W7JPI is on from the county I have yet to operate from (Santa Cruz County). Information about this award is at: http://www.w7yrc.org/az-wac.htm

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Updated AMSAT Symposium schedule;
by Gould Smith 23 Oct '11

23 Oct '11

I have posted an update to the 2011 AMSAT Symposium schedule to include the list of presentations. http://www.amsat.org/amsat-new/symposium/2011/SymposiumSchedule.php Looking forward to a great meeting and learning a great deal from this stellar list of presenters. 73, Gould

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Recycling Old Satellites
by B J 23 Oct '11

23 Oct '11

http://www.darpa.mil/NewsEvents/Releases/2011/10/20.aspx This is one way of dealing with orbital clutter. 73s Bernhard VA6BMJ @ DO33FL

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Re: Knowledge
by Nigel A. Gunn, W8IFF/G8IFF 23 Oct '11

23 Oct '11

If it's a fact then it is not debatable. On 23/10/11 20:00, amsat-bb-request(a)amsat.org wrote: > And I don't think anybody here is debating that very fact.

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Re: AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 6, Issue 586
by Carl Rimmer W8KRF 23 Oct '11

23 Oct '11

I think we are getting way off topic here. If you guys keep putting all your energies into the past, you'll miss the future. Nothing you say here, or do anywhere, is going to change anything. Let's get back to AMSAT and Satellites. How 'bout that ARISSAT-1, huh? Still going strong! 73, *Carl W8KRF* On 10/23/2011 12:38 PM, amsat-bb-request(a)amsat.org wrote: > Send AMSAT-BB mailing list submissions to > amsat-bb(a)amsat.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > amsat-bb-request(a)amsat.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > amsat-bb-owner(a)amsat.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of AMSAT-BB digest..." > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 23 Oct 2011 01:07:42 -0400 > From: Joe Leikhim<rhyolite(a)nettally.com> > To: amsat-bb(a)amsat.org > Subject: [amsat-bb] Re: knowledge required > Message-ID:<4EA3A11E.5020808(a)nettally.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Whats with these kids today, they can't drive a car unless it has automatic transmission. Don't get me going about these wimps and their "paddle shifters". If you can't drive stick shift and double clutch(without synchromesh), you should just stay home! > > --> SNIP<-- > > Just give up on trying to explain to some of these drivers! They will never understand what you, Peter and others on here are talking about... > > The way the US has "dumbed down" the drivers license requirements produced them... > > --> SNAP<-- >

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