January 2008 - AMSAT-BB - mailman.amsat.org

AO-16
by Farrell Winder 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Could anyone in Eastern part of US confirm that AO-16 is presently active? Nothing heard on pass beginning 20:19 Z Cincinnati. Tnx, Farrell Winder, W8ZCF

2 1

Re: AO-16
by Andrew Glasbrenner 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

http://oscar.dcarr.org/ N8ABY heard it sometime between 20:30 and 20:45. That is a great site to use for a sanity check on whether a satellite is active or not, except for the occasional erroneous entry. 73, Drew KO4MA -----Original Message----- >From: Farrell Winder <fwinder(a)fuse.net> >Sent: Jan 30, 2008 3:34 PM >To: AMSAT <amsat-bb(a)amsat.org> >Subject: [amsat-bb] AO-16 > >Could anyone in Eastern part of US confirm that AO-16 is presently active? Nothing heard on pass beginning 20:19 Z Cincinnati. >Tnx, Farrell Winder, W8ZCF >_______________________________________________ >Sent via AMSAT-BB(a)amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. >Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! >Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb

1 0

PREDICT! Re: Long time eclipse prediction
by Mark L. Hammond 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Hi Chris, You can use PREDICT for this very purpose! You can look days and months ahead to see when a satellite in in eclipse, how much illumination it should receive, etc. It's really slick. http://www.qsl.net/kd2bd/predict.html Pick your OS, download, read a bit, and have at it. Thanks to Bruce WB9ANQ for directing me to this software just a few days ago and to John KD2BD for a great program! 73, Mark N8MH ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Bloy" <chris(a)photofuture.co.uk> To: <amsat-bb(a)amsat.org> Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2008 8:15 AM Subject: [amsat-bb] Long time eclipse prediction > Hi All, > > I have never been able to get a straight answer on this one, but does > InstantTrack or any other program show you the long term > non-eclispse/eclispe period, or is there a way to calculate this? > > How do we know that PCSAT and UO11 are going to HIT sunlight or not for a > period of time? > > I can see from Orbitron the realtime, but not anything in the future? > > Thanks, > > Chris > -- Mark L. Hammond [N8MH]

2 1

AO-16 pass
by ANTHONY JAPHA 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Just heard a few brief USB syllables on the 1850Z 4 degree pass here, but couldn't make it out. Had a couple of minutes to Eu., but not possible from indoors here. I'm sure a QSO could have been made if I were outside. Oh well, spring is just around a few corners. Who was that masked man just now? Anyone from across the pond? 73, Tony, N2UN ANTHONY JAPHA tjjapha(a)earthlink.net EarthLink Revolves Around You.

1 0

Explorer I launch Anniversary
by Davidoff, Martin 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Explorer I (First US success) was launched 50 years ago (31 January 1958). An article on today's NY Times Website credits Amateur Radio operators with being the first to confirm that it was in orbit and operating. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/29/science/space/29space.html de K2ubc

1 0

BBS inefficiency -vs- PACSAT protocol
by Robert Bruninga 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

>> It is extremely inefficient to attempt to logon >> to [the ISS] BBS over Europe/USA since it blocks >> other users from the more efficient digipeater >> mode designed for those high density areas. > > This Apples and Oranges comparison. There is a huge > difference between a Store-And-Forward Mail box and an > Unacknowledged Broadcast packet. With an Unproto > Packet you never know if anyone heard your one-way > packet. Ah, but you do. You see it in the downlink. Congestion on the ISS packet system is only on the uplink. Rarely if ever on the downlink. If you see it in the downlink, then everyone else and the recepient should have seen it too... Very efficient without needing ACKS and RETRIES and CONNECTIONS, and CONNECT REQUESTS, and TIMEOUTS, and REJECT packets.. > Store-And-Forward packet mail has a whole different > set of uses. We used Packet Mail on Space Station Mir > for 10+ years.... Yes, but back then the crew had no other alternative for email. Now they have easy email 24/7. But I agree, it "works" fine, but one has to be careful how we define "works". Over the USA or Europe, it only works for one user and only if that user has killowatts of ERP to step on all other packets to complete his connection (or lives in Hawaii, or other island nation surrounded by no other users within 1200 miles). > The ISS Packet Mail project never caught on > because we had Hardware and software problems > with the TNC's and we never were assigned > a dedicated Laptop. ... The current system can > only support 1 mail box user at a time. But even with only one, in a congestion environment and the requirement for ACKS of every line received, the success rate for the average user is so low and frustration level so high, that it is impractical for the common user and all the lost packets and retries consume the entire pass at the expense of everyone else on frequency. > Marex has received initial approval to upgrade the > system to a Kantronics System that will support 5+ > mail box users and also includes full remote control > from ground System Operators. A worthy goal, but that will only multiply the existing impracticality by a factor of 5 in QRM and virtually nothing will get through (unless there is a drastic change to the protocol). That is why ALL flying BBS's since the mid 1980's use the PACSAT protocol which avoids all of the congestion issues of the normal AX.25 CONNECTED style BBS. The PACSAT protocol: 1) Continuously streams the MAIL List. 2) Allows everyone to capture the MAIL list passively without having to transmit a single packet. 3) Everyones software captures every line from every file on the BBS and builds its own copy of the files. (still passively without transmitting a single packet). 4) As needed stations can requist "fills" of missing lines. Still all other stations also capture these "fills" to minimize the number of requests and repeats. 5) Ground software automatically manages the access to avoid user congestion on the uplink and software contributes to equal sharing of the BBS. 6) Discourteous users can not easily hog the asset. The result was the PACSAT protocol that allowed multiple accesses, by dozens of stations able to download megabytes per day and was efficient, and completely avoided all the ACK problems of terrestrial BBS's when flown in space. Every digital satellite since AO16 has used the PACSAT protocol for their store-and-forward BBS's: AO16, LO18, KO23, KO25, IO26, UO22, GO32, AO51 and others. There are very good, published and well thought our reasons for this. > If you would like to see a multiple user Mail box > on ISS please help support Marex, it's a > long road into space. My next hardware demo is > scheduled for Moscow in June 2008. This sounds like a great project, but only if such a multi-user BBS will take advantage of the lessons learned for more than 20 years in Amateur Space and avoid any BBS that requires line-by-line acknowledgment. If they can implement the multi-user scheme as used on the PACSATS for the last 20 years, then that will be a great advantage to users by at least an order of magnitude. Bob, WB4APR

1 0

ISS Packet Digi-Path?
by Tony 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

All, What's the digi-path for the ISS? Is it RS0ISS-? or just ARISS? Thanks, Tony -K2MO

4 5

Re: Ande Deorbit award received
by andy thomas 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Mine safely received today too. A great reminder of a special event for us telemetry-chasers! ...Me mind on fire, me soul on fire Feelin' hot hot hot Party people, all around me Feelin' hot hot hot... 73 de andy g0SFJ __________________________________________________________ Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail.yahoo.com

1 0

Translation of FM satellite article going well
by OZ1MY 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Hi all, As of now the article "Considerate operating practice" have reached Russia, Germany, UK, Spain and Italy :-) If you want to join in just send me an e-mail and I will send you the updated version. A large thanks to those who have responded already. See you on the satellites. 73 OZ1MY Ib

1 0

25 watt Moonbounce
by Trevor 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

The story in the UK Scarborough Evening News about Angus Young M0IKB achieving Moonbounce with just 25 watts is a good illustration of the huge advances Amateurs have made in Moonbounce techniques over recent years. Not long ago it would have taken over 400 watts to achieve it. Why Angus is over the Moon - Scarborough Today (with picture of Angus) http://www.scarborougheveningnews.co.uk/news/Why-Angus-is-over-the.3686368.… Ham makes EME contact with just 25 watts http://www.southgatearc.org/news/january2008/record_eme_contact.htm The call book entry for Angus Young M0IKB can be seen at http://www.eham.net/callbook/M0IKB 73 Trevor M5AKA __________________________________________________________ Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail.yahoo.com

4 5

FO-29 schedule Feb.
by Mineo Wakita 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Feb. UTC 1 2:10 - 2 3:00 - 3 2:06 - 4 none 5 3:45 - 6 2:50 - 7 3:45 - 8 2:46 - 9 3:36 - 10 2:42 - 11 3:33 - 12 none 13 3:28 - 14 2:33 - 15 3:23 - 16 2:30 - 17 3:20 - 18 none 19 3:15 - 20 2:20 - 21 3:10 - 22 2:15 - 23 3:05 - 24 3:55 - 25 none

1 0

Long time eclipse prediction
by Chris Bloy 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Hi All, I have never been able to get a straight answer on this one, but does InstantTrack or any other program show you the long term non-eclispse/eclispe period, or is there a way to calculate this? How do we know that PCSAT and UO11 are going to HIT sunlight or not for a period of time? I can see from Orbitron the realtime, but not anything in the future? Thanks, Chris

5 5

Re: AO-27 Telem
by Mike Rupprecht 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Hi Chris, yes, we should contact the AO-27 team and ask for the missing channel equations. Regarding your question for the MixW settings. I described this on my website - but it's in german. You can take a look at http://www.dk3wn.info/mixw_kiss.shtml But (it's easier for you) read here: http://www.mixw.co.uk/tune/tuneaprs/tuneaprs.html It's quite simple. I will write a decoding software for AO-27 (with KISS input) - the telemetry is similar to IO-26. You can see my decoding software here: http://www.dk3wn.info/software.shtml 73, Mike DK3WN -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Chris Bloy [mailto:chris@photofuture.co.uk] Gesendet: Dienstag, 29. Januar 2008 21:42 An: 'Mike Rupprecht'; 'SV1BSX' Betreff: RE: [amsat-bb] Re: AO-27 Telem Hi Mike, Mak, Any idea on the setting for MixW as I cannot get anything to decode even close to your example? I think that we should have access to telemetry on this one, and would be willing to collect and build up a picture of what AO-27 is doing? Perhaps we should contact Amrad and ask? Thanks, Chris -----Original Message----- From: Mike Rupprecht [mailto:mail@mike-rupprecht.de] Sent: 29 January 2008 18:00 To: 'SV1BSX' Cc: 'Chris Bloy' Subject: AW: [amsat-bb] Re: AO-27 Telem Hi Mak, yes - and no. AO-27 send it's telemetry in non-AX.25 frames. There is no standard UI Frame and the most packet radio programs cannot decode this frames. BUT, you can use any TNC in KISS mode to generate a data file. The structure of AO-27 telemetry is similar to IO-26 or the other microsats. 1 Byte Channel number + 1 Byte channel value -> see my posting on AMSAT-BB. AND there are some soundcard solutions (e.g. MixW) to generate an KISS file. 73, Mike Dk3WN -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: amsat-bb-bounces(a)amsat.org [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@amsat.org] Im Auftrag von SV1BSX Gesendet: Dienstag, 29. Januar 2008 15:55 An: Chris Bloy Cc: amsat-bb(a)amsat.org Betreff: [amsat-bb] Re: AO-27 Telem Hi Chris, I think it's impossible the receiving of TLM without a TNC (hardware). I tried also with "standalone" 1200Bps AFSK softwares for packet radio (like MIXW etc) without success. And yes, the TLM is "ON" just for a few seconds at the beginning (and at the end) of each "active" pass. 73, Mak SV1BSX ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Bloy" <chris(a)photofuture.co.uk> To: <amsat-bb(a)amsat.org> Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2008 15:12 Subject: [amsat-bb] AO-27 Telem > Hi All, > > Can anyone tell me how to decode the telemetry from AO27? > > I have tried to use MIXW in Packet mode and RTTY mode, but all I seem to > get > is the date and nothing else? I even tried to feed it through AGWE to see > if > that would work.. I use AO27 all the time and use a minidisc recorder to > record my passes, and always capture the telem data at the end.. it would > be > good if someone could help me out on this one? > > Thanks, > > Chris > > _______________________________________________ > Sent via AMSAT-BB(a)amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! > Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb > > > --- > avast! Antivirus: Inbound message clean. > Virus Database (VPS): 080127-0, 01/27/2008 > Tested on: 1/29/2008 15:54:42 > avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2008 ALWIL Software. > http://www.avast.com > > > --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 080127-0, 01/27/2008 Tested on: 1/29/2008 16:55:20 avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2008 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com _______________________________________________ Sent via AMSAT-BB(a)amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the author. Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program! Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb ____________ Virus checked by G DATA AntiVirusKit Version: AVK 18.2572 from 28.01.2008 Virus news: www.antiviruslab.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.15/1249 - Release Date: 29/01/2008 09:51 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.15/1249 - Release Date: 29/01/2008 09:51 ____________ Virus checked by G DATA AntiVirusKit Version: AVK 18.2584 from 29.01.2008 Virus news: www.antiviruslab.com

2 1

G6LVB Tracker Kits
by john 30 Jan '08

30 Jan '08

Hello, I currently use this interface with nova for windows. It works very well, but I have a problem with moving arrows on the keyboard or with the paddle of nova because no data is transmitted, is this normal? Thanks for your help john No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.15/1249 - Release Date: 29/01/2008 TiTi 09:51 -- Ce message a été vérifié par MailScanner pour des virus ou des polluriels et rien de suspect n'a été trouvé. MailScanner remercie transtec pour son soutien.

1 0

Sign up for Penelope Boards now!
by Scott Cowling 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

Just in case anyone here is not on the HPSDR list... 73, Scotty WA2DFI *** TAPR ANNOUNCES PRODUCTION OF HPSDR PENELOPE BOARD *** High Performance Software Defined Radio Project (HPSDR) *IMPORTANT* 29 January 2008 TAPR and HPSDR need your input! You have until Sunday, February 5, 2008 at 0200 UTC to take action on this message and express interest to obtain a finished tested board, partial kit or bare PCB for this project. Production quantities will be determined by the collective expression of interest at this time. To register your interest you need to go to Dale's (WA8SRA) HAMSDR website, in the projects section. If you are a member and have previously expressed interest in these projects, log in and re-enter your Quantities of each board. NOTE: Previous quantities have been reset to zero so you WILL HAVE TO RE-ENTER QUANTITIES. If you are new to HPSDR and Dale's Website, please join for instant access by providing the information requested. Go NOW to: HTTP://www.hamsdr.com Login and go to Projects > TAPR-HPSDR and follow instructions provided on that page. What is HPSDR? http://hpsdr.org What is a Penelope? http://hpsdr.org/penelope.html There are many other HPSDR projects in design and testing; please see the HPSDR website for details.

3 2

Re: gpredict
by Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

I didn't say that the denigration was always valid, but we used to switch an 11/45 betwen RSTS and V6 (I think) Unix and could handle as many users, and those users could do a lot more. System V was later and known as a pig, even then, which lead to BSD Unix. I actually liked DOS-11 a lot, for a single-user system. 73, doug Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2008 20:50:44 -0500 From: Anthony Monteiro <aa2tx(a)comcast.net> At 01:10 PM 1/29/2008, Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 wrote: >Err, the DEC machines that ran Unix were (mostly) '11's and VAXen, and >while it may not be in the literature, there was a LOT of denigration >of the DEC-provided OS's, like DOS, VMS, RSTS, and RSX. > > Nate Duehr wrote: > > On Jan 28, 2008, at 11:32 PM, don wrote: > > > >> The PDP series ran unix, and I still have the original Bell System > >> Journals here at home describing the philosophy and design behind the > >> unix system. I tried over the last few days of re reading these > >> journals > >> to find any reference to the denigrating of any other systems or their > >> users... Are linux users and prophets now straying far from the > >> original > >> tracks for unix? > > > >I picked up my first Unix disk by going to Murray Hills and being loaned >an RK05 pack to take it back in my van (which had PDP-11 license >plates). Hi Doug! I worked at Bell Labs back then and guess what? When we needed good performance, we used VMS! The first release of UNIX System V did not have demand paged virtual memory but VMS did so it was significantly faster for big jobs like chip layouts and simulations. A very simple chip back then (2.5 micron) took overnight on a dedicated VAX11/780 to do the layout and simulation. Of course, this was a 1 MIPS machine (and that is being polite.) The original WeCo 3B2 mini computers were actually slower than even the cheapest IBM PC running DOS partly because the UNIX implementations were so bad (again no demand paged VM.) On the outside we probably laughed at DOS and VMS but on the inside we knew the truth! Enjoy the memories (some of them virtual and written to /DEV/NULL in my case!) 73, Tony AA2TX

1 0

Video of indoor, ultra-cheap cubesat operations
by Bruce Robertson 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

I had a chance to do some more listening in on CO-55 using my FT-817 radio and a 1/4 wave ground-plane made of wire and a BNC. Given the number of all-band, all-mode radios that are available now, I think a simple experiment like this could be great fun to many hams, especially those who might fear that satellite operations of any sort are prohibitively expensive. In hopes of illustrating to them and others, I made a short video of the actual reception, to be viewed here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1251407580465862002 The audio does not do justice to the CW reception: it seems to roll off in the low frequencies so I was able to copy the telemetry much better than it might seem. I was tempted to process the audio, but I figured people know that these sorts of video recordings have crummy audio. I suppose the video needs some contextualizing for non-Amsat folks, but it's a start.

4 5

Re: Macbook and U232-P9 serial U232-P9
by Bill Howell 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

Andrew, This may or may not help... I use a Keyspan USA-19HS with Mac (non-Intel) and Windows. Here's a link http://www.keyspan.com/products/usa19hs/ Bill Howell

1 0

Ande Deorbit award received
by john heath 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

Trying to capture the very last telemetry frames from Ande as it de-orbited was a lot of fun. Chasing the award made it even more exciting. Thanks guys for a great job in creating this award, and following through with such slick execution. I received the award in the mail today, beautifully presented, and signed by Mike DK3WN. 73 John g7hia

1 0

SAT contacts for WAS AWARD
by David Bird 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

HI ALL, I AM ALMOST THERE JUST HAVE 3 MORE STATES TO GO.I NEED DELAWARE, MAINE,AND ROAD ISLAND! PLEASE HELP IF YOU CAN.TNX AND 73 DE KC7USS _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join

1 0

AO-27 Telem
by Chris Bloy 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

Hi All, Can anyone tell me how to decode the telemetry from AO27? I have tried to use MIXW in Packet mode and RTTY mode, but all I seem to get is the date and nothing else? I even tried to feed it through AGWE to see if that would work.. I use AO27 all the time and use a minidisc recorder to record my passes, and always capture the telem data at the end.. it would be good if someone could help me out on this one? Thanks, Chris

4 6

Re: Long time eclipse prediction
by John Marranca, Jr 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

Chris: Put Orbitron into simulated mode and manually advance it 1 day at a time....you'll see the eclipse or lack thereof first-hand.... John KB2HSH -- _______________________________ John Marranca, Jr PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122 BN Systems, Inc Orchard Park, NY (716)972-2006

2 1

Re: A considerate operating practice on FM (one channel) satellites
by John Marranca, Jr 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

Likewise....trying to connect to the ISS BBS during PRIMETIME HOURS. Plenty of folks I talk with are getting fed up with it. John KB2HSH -- _______________________________ John Marranca, Jr PBX Technician/Shop Steward CWA Local 1122 BN Systems, Inc Orchard Park, NY (716)972-2006

2 1

Fw: A considerate operating practice on FM (one channel)satellites, Europe
by john heath 29 Jan '08

29 Jan '08

> An Excellent post from Ib > > How about we all try to get a short item in our national ham radio > magazines covering "Good Operating Practice on Satellites" (probably with > a more imaginative headline...) > > I expect that most people on this bb know how to behave on the satellites, > its the less experienced ops. who need the guidance. > > 73 John g7hia

1 0

Re: A considerate operating practice on FM (one channel) satellites
by Dave Guimont 28 Jan '08

28 Jan '08

>Likewise....trying to connect to the ISS BBS during PRIMETIME HOURS. > >Plenty of folks I talk with are getting fed up with it. > Yes, John, Just like any other 2-user channel (FM) that is open to hundreds of operators at the same time. Of course, the answer is, bandwidth on ssb/cw like was done years ago!! The attempt at promoting HT radio, because of expense and a little degree of difficulty, has obviously been a failure... And obviously some ulterior motive, and it has really cost AMSAT-NA.. It sold some HT's probably, which is OK, but put AMSAT-NA pre OSCAR 1!! Other worldwide AMSAT's have apparently figured it out!! And amateur satellite radio will survive.... 73, Dave, WB6LLO dguimon1(a)san.rr.com Disagree: I learn.... Pulling for P3E...

1 0