June 2011 - AMSAT-BB - mailman.amsat.org

Re: FD Mess
by Edward R. Cole 28 Jun '11

28 Jun '11

At 05:10 AM 6/28/2011, R Oler wrote: >What is to prevent someone from designating themselves "net >control"? sorry this plan is doomed Robert Oler WB5MZO Live member >ARRL AMSAT NARS Ah you are inventing problems. The "real NC" would quickly assert their position. There are lots of nets held on ham radio...how often do others claim to be net control...virtually never. If you are saying someone will cause malicious interference, there is no cure other than peer pressure and official FCC action. The way to introduce Net Controlled passes is to do it in advance of FD. In fact the idea might catch on when folks find it manages the typical "FM chaos" that reigns currently. I propose there be a Net Day every month on certain FM satellites starting with AO-51, if it is healthy enough. Good practise for a real "emergency comm" situation. There are ARES Nets held regularly all over the nation on VHF/UHF... why not on satellite? 73, Ed - KL7UW, WD2XSH/45 ====================================== BP40IQ 500 KHz - 10-GHz www.kl7uw.com EME: 50-1.1kw?, 144-1.4kw, 432-100w, 1296-60w, 3400-? DUBUS Magazine USA Rep dubususa(a)gmail.com ======================================

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sat for emergencies
by jerry keeton 28 Jun '11

28 Jun '11

Actually the net control station would only have to confirm each station calling.Station info passed when calling and net control confirms station info . Much more organized than 50 operators calling 50 other operators. Checking into a net is very organized . I can't see where it would be a waste of time. Guess I'm dense. Jerry WB5LHD

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FD Mess
by wa4hfn＠comcast.net 28 Jun '11

28 Jun '11

It took me 5 satellite passes before I could make 1 contact There were too many ops making what sounded like HI POWER multi contacts .This should not have happened. Maybe someone with good writting skills could send the ARRL world above 50 an artical on how to work the birds during FD WA4HFN em55 Damon

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Re: FD Mess
by Joe 28 Jun '11

28 Jun '11

On 6/27/2011 11:17 PM, Gary "Joe" Mayfield wrote: > Is it fair he gets to make more contacts with his bigger better station? I think I would argue it is. It is his reward for all of that effort. Did he make it possible for stations that may not have otherwise made a contact 80 to make a contact? Yes, he did. He was monopolizing the frequency, but it seemed to make for a lot of contacts.... > > Joe kk0sd All good and true, BUT.... did he monopolize the whole 80 meter band so no one else could use it? NO. There is a BIG difference there. Joe WB9SBD

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Re: FD Mess
by k6yk 28 Jun '11

28 Jun '11

FD is a mess every year. No matter what bird(s) you try. Most of the FD stations have no clue about satellites, they just get the idea they need to make 1 satellite contact or as many as they can. They don't know about all the rules particular to AMSAT, and they dont' care. They ask somebody what frequency to transmit and listen on and then they get their 500 watt amp, big beam or no beam, no preamp, and start calling and calling. They don't hear anything so they just mess up the whole works. Happens every year. You either have to bear with it and make your one contact or give up. 73, K6YK On Mon, 27 Jun 2011 21:33:34 +0100 Gordon JC Pearce <gordonjcp(a)gjcp.net> writes: > On Mon, 27 Jun 2011 13:48:48 -0500 > Patrick Green <pagreen(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > The ARRL should impose an ERP limit for satellite contacts. That > > would solve the problem. I don't see how running amplifiers on FD > is > > in the spirit of what FD is all about. I've made contacts using > 50 mw > > so why do stations use 100+ watts *before* the antenna.. I > wouldn't > > want my kids playing around a FD site with this time of setup. > > Wouldn't that be AMSAT's job? It's certainly possible to work an FM > bird with 5W from a handie, and a hand-held yagi. > > I don't understand the obsession with having all-singing-all-dancing > computer-controlled setups, where it automatically updates its > orbital elements, automatically calculates when the next pass is, > automatically calculates where to steer the aerial and what to tune > the radio to and leaving the operator to just push the PTT and shout > over the top of the QRP/P stations. > > All the computer-controlled stuff just plain isn't amateur radio. > If you want to sit in front of a computer and talk to people, use > Skype. > > Gordon MM0YEQ > _______________________________________________ > Sent via AMSAT-BB(a)amsat.org. Opinions expressed are those of the > author. > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite > program! > Subscription settings: http://amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb > ____________________________________________________________ Groupon&#8482 Official Site 1 ridiculously huge coupon a day. Get 50-90% off your city's best! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/4e08f240241f6c2ab4st04vuc

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AMSAT-BB MESS
by Kevin Deane 27 Jun '11

27 Jun '11

I tried my hardest all day to stay out of the "MESS" and after reading through a hundred or so messages I just cant help myself. Now this one and done "rule"... I was driving from southern Cal back to Nevada on Sat. and I didnt even think to try and make a contact mobile, glad I didnt from what I have read...but I did make a contact or two on Sun. Sometimes people are so well mannered I cant even believe it, all kinds of contacts, no one stepping on each other just fantastic. Other times its just like CH 19 as my friend in Oregon would say... I am guilty of making more than one contact per pass, I say hi to the regulars and try for unfamiliar calls and have fun everytime, sometimes I get walked on, a couple times I have not even plugged in the rught coax, so what I am human. Sure I get frustrated sometimes but then I realize that this is just a hobby and everyone makes mistakes and might not operate properly. You people who make up these "rules" I am sure they are well thought out and meant for good reasons...such and such power, this many contacts, use this type of modulation, only operate on this mode, WHATEVER people spend their whole life building a station and they are gonna be heard, I say good for them! If the world was perfect it sure would be BORING!!! Kevin KF7MYK

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Re: FD Mess
by Bill Acito W1PA 27 Jun '11

27 Jun '11

I did not participate in FD this year, but I have certainly heard my share of them in recent years. I think we have to let go of the mantra that “any use of the bandwidth is good use” with respect to “encouraging more satellite activity”. Wasn’t that the original intent of the “100 point bonus” items? To encourage specific activities – traffic handling, promotion, emergency power, etc. The FM birds have fixed bandwidth -- nothing we can do. There is no mechanism to restrict FD stations to only one QSO on any FM bird. If you read the FD rules, you can make multiple contacts on the SSB birds, and they do count for QSO credit beyond the 100 point bonus – you can only make one QSO on any FM bird: 7.3.7. Satellite QSO: 100 bonus points for successfully completing at least one QSO via an amateur radio satellite during the Field Day period. "General Rules for All ARRL Contests" (Rule 3.7.2.), (the no-repeater QSO stipulation) is waived for satellite QSOs. Groups are allowed one dedicated satellite transmitter station without increasing their entry category. Satellite QSOs also count for regular QSO credit. Show them listed separately on the summary sheet as a separate "band." You do not receive an additional bonus for contacting different satellites, though the additional QSOs may be counted for QSO credit unless prohibited under Rule 7.3.7.1. The QSO must be between two Earth stations through a satellite. Available to Classes A, B, and F. 7.3.7.1 Stations are limited to one (1) completed QSO on any single channel FM satellite. And there is certainly no mechanism to restrict the ERP that gets used. Is anyone really surprised it sounds like it does? IMHO, I think it does more harm than good in promoting this aspect of the hobby, for a potential newbie to hear the FM birds on FD... restrict activity to the transponder (SSB/CW) birds and be done with it – no FM satellite QSO’s at all during FD. Or have it like the ARRL Bulletin --- RX only; copy some valid telemetry to get points. Bill W1PA

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Re: Hams Embarrass Again
by Clint Bradford 27 Jun '11

27 Jun '11

>> ... and as you said, the pass was populated by well behaved operators. >> ... And thanks for doing all those presentations. One of these days we'll get you on a linear bird! Just yesterday a visitor to my "Work the FM Sats" left me a message" "Hey, how 'bout the OTHER sats we can work?" He was an honest-to-gawd satellite scientist from the 60s and 70s. WAY TOO ADVANCED (pardon the pun) for my meager Web site's offerings. But I am still finding appreciative audiences for the "basics" of working the FM birds - even after giving 60+ presentations the past three or so years. Clint, K6LCS P.S. - If any of you live in CA and have personalized license plates, watch for my next post ...

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Hams Embarrass Again
by Clint Bradford 27 Jun '11

27 Jun '11

I am so glad there are so few actually involved in this list. Fellow hams here are again becoming an embarrassment to the hobby. Whining and moaning about the lack of use of the FM birds 364 days out of the year ... Now hams are complaining that the FM birds were too busy for them to access for Field Day. Additionally, it's been sad to see how many illiterate hams we have in this group - as few cannot read the Field Day rules and properly interpret some pretty basic sentences as they apply to working the satellites. Then we have the "The odds of getting a "real ham" on the ISS are pretty small in my view" folks - truly a "view" of ignorance. It's like complaining, "How DARE the astronauts aboard not come out and play with me on amateur radio." Yes, there was fifteen minutes scheduled for amateur radio contacts last weekend. (Very few actually read the daily schedules for the astronauts - if they did, they'd realize that those aboard the ISS complete more tasks before lunch each day than you and I perform in many times that time.) But to moan that they chose to perform another task and now demeaning them as "not REAL hams" is insulting. I witnessed similar immature behavior from my fellow hams last April 12, when we were hoping that ARISSat-1 would be activated for the Yuri Gagarin commemorations world-wide. Hams were screaming bloody murder when Web sites weren't being updated second-by-second to meet their demands for information. I repeat myself from an earlier post (same sentiment as a subsequent post by another) - Hams on the west coast of the United States performed well on the FM satellites last weekend. I am proud to live on this "left coast," as I read that others had "problems" elsewhere. I am giving my 13th formal satellite presentation of the year to a group tomorrow night ... Seems I do not have to change a thing that is taught to fellow hams out here. Clint Bradford, K6LCS http://www.work-sat.com 909-241-7666

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Re: How to get started on SSB birds (antennas)
by Joe Krepps 27 Jun '11

27 Jun '11

All, I appreciate that this topic has been brought up (especially _after_ FD, HiHi!!). If I may inject a question: for the seriously budget minded, is there any value to building a "better antenna" (i.e. more elements for improved gain) versus adding a pre-amp? I realize a higher gain antenna will be more sensitive to positioning/aiming and, unless I go the U-110 rotator route, I won't be doing much elevation adjustment. I'll be using either my current FT-817ND or an eBay all mode 2m transciever, for AO-7. In Mode A, rx with the FT-817ND & tx with a "well loved" 2m all mode. In Mode B, rx with the 2m all mode and Tx with the FT-817ND. Of course, dialing the power down as often as practical! (Now, I kinda' wish I could have held onto my old IC-820H, Yaesu Az/El rotators and "Oscar link" crossed yagis...but I needed $$ at the time. Now, I'm married so, by definition, I'm broke. HiHi!) I appreciate ALL the wisdom shared so far! :) Mny tnx & 73! Joe WB3CFN P.S. I _do_ have an Arrow but not sure how suitable it is for continuous outdoor use.

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